I’m currently learning how to code (currently Python, then maybe JavaScript), but I’m not always around my desktop, and learning on my phone is not always an option (also, it can be quite cumbersome at times). Therefore, I’m looking into purchasing a laptop just for learning how to code and stuff.
I don’t want to get a Chromebook because I want to be able to wipe the drive and install Linux on it (probably Linux Mint). Maybe it’s changed since 2013, but the last time I had a Chromebook, it was a pain in the ass to install even bog-standard Ubuntu on it.
Problem is, I’m also heavily limited by space & budget: no more than 11 in (280 mm) total laptop width and 330 USD base price.
Does anyone have any suggestions?
Please forgive me if this is not the right space for this kind of question. Lemme know if it is and I’ll delete it. :)
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Used Dell XPS, Thorvalds’ own choice of laptop, and often ranked well on iFixIt reparability ratings
I’ve been using a Dell XPS-15 9560 for over six years now, the keyboard needed to be cleaned after four years and and the charging port needed to be replaced (€10 inc service) recently. The battery no longer lasts 11 or so hours but it lasts 2 or so which I’ll take, for about €100 I could replace just the battery.
All of which, for how fast devices tend to break on me, is an incredibly good mileage I’d say!And oh yeah, whatever Linux I’ve been distro hopping to has worked swimmingly!
It’s probably best to limit yourself to a used laptop.
Reading and writing code is nothing more than reading and writing text, and for that you don’t need a fancy gpu or screen.
What I would recommend you look for in a laptop is
- an SSD instead of an HDD
- more cpu cores (at least 4 cores)
- more memory (RAM) (at least 8GB, preferably 16GB+)
More memory and cores will help you with compiling and running your code.
And make sure you take regular backups! You never know when your disk will fail.
Also make sure to check linux compatibility before you buy. Laptops used to be a pain (10+ years ago), and it’s gotten a lot better, but it’s not always perfect. Just search for “[brand] [model] linux” or try to find the model on the archlinux wiki.
an SSD instead of an HDD
I’d rather search for upgradeability, i.e., non-soldered RAM, easy access to HDD, maybe replace the optical drive with an HDD caddy, etc…
Well, just for learning coding on Linux OP wouldn’t need 16GB.
I feel people used to having more RAM always recommended insane amounts of RAM. 4 GB gets you by running a browser or PDF viewer with a code editor, 8 or more GB is recommended IMO.
Thank you for being thorough! I appreciate the advice! :)
You’re welcome!
I’m sorry that I don’t have any advice for a specific laptop, but it seems others are helping with that already.
It’s cool. Don’t worry about it! I appreciate any advice someone can give. :)
is nothing more than reading writing text
Unless you’re compiling rust.
- Mic drop *
More memory and cores will help you with compiling and running your code.
Have you even read my comment?
Whooosh!
Sound of a joke passing over you
For Linux I would just find the best ThinkPad within your budget (a used one, in this case)
Edit for an example (and re-edit to clean up link): https://www.ebay.com/itm/134956529143
Thinkpads are not cheap as they have that reputation.
But they have good Linux support
Btw that link has tons of tracking BS in it
That’s one of the most insane links I have ever seen. I’m scared to click it.
But I second a ThinkPad.
Should be the same link without the tracking
You make a great point, but the problem is I’ve looked at a ton of them and they all seem to be too big. I have a very limited primary workspace at only 11 inches and for example the T14 Gen 1 you linked to is 12.95 inches in width.
Oops, I missed that part. There’s the X280 and its predecessors (X270, X260, etc.). The screen is 12.5" so the overall dimensions should be OK.
12.5" is too big. If the screen itself is 12.5", then the total laptop width (if the screen is 16:9) will almost certainly be bigger than that. Like I said, my primary workspace is limited strictly to a max of 11 inches.
…Unless you knew that and I’m completely misunderstanding you. Which, mind you, is definitely a possibility. Lol. So, I’m sorry if that’s the case and I humbly would ask you to elaborate. ;)
FYI 12.5" is the diagonal, it’s going to be much narrower
Probably used is the right answer. Be mindful of battery life and wear.
Usually Lenovo Thinkpads are a safe choice.
ThinkPad, used. Only mainstream brand that cares about Linux.
I found a thinkpad with a radeon GPU for only 200 which was nice.
My ASUS laptop runs Linux well. It was around $800 5 years ago, when I bought it.
I am still using it.
You sure about that?. Where does this myth come from that Lenovo cares about Linux users?
This is exactly the shit that gets me worried about ARM laptops becoming the norm. Obviously, the CPU has ✨full upstream support✨, but what some people seem to forget is that they will likely not support ACPI via Arm System Ready which is exactly how android phones work. (This is the total opposite of what we want btw) So now we will be at the mercy of OEMs releasing blobs or some people will have to spend lots of time creating DTBs for each possible SKU (Snapdragon Elite X’s Linux post even mentions booting with Device Trees, but nobody seemed to notice this for some reason?).
Like, sure, mainline support for the SoC is crucial, but most ARM processors have okayish support, even the mobile chips have say GPU support. The thing is the support of the SoC is only part of the equation when you also have a display, a boatload of controllers for charging, IO, display, etc. etc. that also need to be recognized and supported for the computer to be usable.
I have faith that Dell and Lenovo will offer DTBs for their enterprise devices, since they currently officially support Linux, but for all the other ones, Asus, regular XPS, non ThinkPad Lenovo, Microsoft surface, Samsung, Acer etc. I can almost guarantee they will be troublesome.
I desperately hope to be proven wrong when these laptops get into customers hands, but my hopes are really low.
I have faith
I don’t, linux is niche for these companies, not worth their time/money.
https://ahoneybun.net/blog/Thinkpad-X13s-review/
If you knew how to disable Microsoft Secure feature, maybe you could be competent enough to load Linux on it. But you will now run around calling Lenovo bad for Linux and all that, spreading the myth someone invented like a disease, even though you are the one considering these ARM devices over a proper x86 machine with freedom. Maybe avoid ARM machines for a while, and avoid MS Secure Boot crap?
You’re the one that made the claim that they’re the “only mainstream brand that cares about Linux”. It’s up to you to prove it.
Removed by mod
Used ThinkPad
And old ThinkPad.
Used latitude.
I picked up a used Latitude 7300 (I think?) last year and am quite happy with it. I appreciate that I can replace the ram and ssd myself for repair / upgrade.
I’m running Mint on it and haven’t noticed any problems.
Steam Deck. I’m half serious if you got a wireless mini keyboard with touch pad. You can play games on it too BTW ;)
Lol, that’s kind of intriguing honestly. Are Python interpreters even available on whatever fork of Linux that SteamDecks use? Haha.
Yes. Steam Deck is based on Arch linux. I even have PyCharm installed.
This amuses me.
It doesn’t really surprise me, but it does amuse me.
Thank you for brightening up my week a bit. I’ve had a wisdom tooth removed and have been in a lot of pain, so my past two weeks have sucked.
steam deck is NOT a proper replacement for a work desktop, ymmv
For a desktop yes. You can dock it and forget that it’s not a regular Linux desktop. Especially if it means Python and JS, you don’t need much power for that.
For a laptop not so much, because you’ll need to bring screen+keyboard+mouse and everything to plug them so the portability aspect seriously suffers.
I am super partial to old ThinkPads. Currently I am running an x1 yoga gen 4 that I got from a company that was recycling it for free. I also have a P52, and a t460s. All have been great. I have used several others including an x230, an x201, a w520, w530 and w540(least favorite due to the trackpad). Generally I like to stop at about the Intel 8th gen series as parts are usually still fairly serviceable and affordable.
I do like me some good Thinkpads too. :)
But, unfortunately, all of those are too big. :(
I have a very limited primary workspace, of only room for 11 inches total laptop width.
My bad! You may have totally said that and I missed that part.
You might want to look at the dell XPS 13 series. Their small bezels in the more recent models put them more in line with a MacBook 11 inch. Might be best bang for the buck as far as performance.
Hey no worries!
Thanks for the suggestion!
Rocking a T480 hackintosh over here.
Used t490 / t480. Can you elaborate on the “heavy limited by space”?
The x390/x280 are the same era as these but smaller, so might be a better fit here. The X390 has soldered RAM though, so I’d look for the 16GB version if you can find it (there’s not much of a price difference used)
Unfortunately, those are both too big, at 12.22"–12.28" for the X390, and 12.11" for the X280. I’m limited to 11". :(
Sure, what do you wanna know elaborations wise? I’m sorry; I thought I had elaborated…
I recommend the Thinkpad yoga 11e, which is their education edition. They’re out of stock at the moment, but they’ll come back soon. They always do. It’s an 11 inch laptop with a flip around touch screen and integrated stylus. Works perfectly with Linux. It’s not super fast, but it’s under 300 dollars new. And it’s made for kids so it’s durable. I have one and I love it. You can get one used if you like, but at that point you’re probably better off with an older model.
TIL old ThinkPads were all made for kids.
If you really want to you can combine:
- a raspberry pi (with case)
- a power bank
- a small USB keyboard
- a small portable display
- a mouse
It doesn’t take more space than a laptop :))
At that point you might as well go with a steamdeck. Works with or without the mouse/keyboard/screen and can play games. The desktop environment is full kde and ready to go.
That’s a good idea! Do I need to know any coding or soldering to set up a Raspberry Pi?
No. Just have to burn the OS image to an SD card and plug everything up.
Ooh, nice. That seems like a great initial step for just being in the learning phase. I’m gonna look into this! Thank you! :)
No, just download Raspbian (Debian for RaPi) or any other popular distribution on your main computer and copy it to your RaPi’s SD card. Oh and if your mouse “lags” - you can increase your mouse refresh rate in settings.
Also while the setup obviously works and does its job (and is really fun to use) it’s probably not better than a laptop. It’s more of a thing you use because you can…
…anyway, if you already have some of the parts it’s the cheapest you can get, and it is just as practical as a laptop. I already had a pi4 with case, a keyboard and a mouse, so only was missing a portable monitor and a powerbank (but buying a powerbank never is a bad idea anyway).
Thanks for the tip! Sounds promising!
Yeah get a used laptop. Anything used in good condition is way better than new at the same or often twice the price.
Chromebooks are bad, but they run Coreboot. With MrChromebox and Chrultrabook you can get a normal Coreboot BIOS on there and run any Linux distro.
But they are often not repairable and have extremely limited storage and RAM. Also finding info on many of them is horrible.
