Then they tell you the previous person was incompetent or something to try and make it seem like they were a bad employee, not that it’s a bad work environment.
“Oh? And who was in charge of their interview?” because unless they have a large hr department to handle hiring interviews, it was probably the person who hired you.
This is when you take notes in your notebook you should have brought with you.
I’ve noticed interviewers get visibly uncomfortable when I write in my notebook. It’s like they’re either trying to figure out if they just lied about something I will be able to reference later, or they just get that natural “someone is writing about me and I can’t read what it is” feeling, I assume the former.
Simon Pegg wasn’t lying in Hot Fuzz. The notebook is a powerful weapon if used right.
This is absolutely true. My former employer (a big box retail company) reduced my pay while I was on holiday. I had been there for years and accrued a bunch of pay rises - but the company got bought out and the new owners thought they could strip me of these because they felt they were temporary and non-contractual.
I got some legal advice that basically said they can’t do that sort of thing and had a meeting scheduled with HR. I went in with my notepad, I stayed calm - pleasent even - no angry shouting or slamming tables with fists, I just politely asked them questions and wrote down everything they said, then read their answers back to them to confirm thats what they said. I had about 6 questions prepared and by the 4th they were visibly uncomfortable, it was an amazing feeling making them squirm like that. After I got done asking my questions, I dropped the legal advice I had been given on them and it was obvious the answers they gave supported my case very heavily. They panicked and reversed all there decesion plus I got back-pay.
But if the first thing I had done is charge in making accusations and quoting the law I know nothing constructive would have happened.
See the goal is to bury them in their own words.
Edit: predictably the company went bust the next year. So long Office Outlet!
Always get them to bury themselves before dropping your intentions.
My wife is currently dealing with her employer and their complete lack of handicap spots, despite over 200 regular car spaces scattered all around a warehouse lot. She doesn’t quite get how to “play the game” like this but she’s learning.
One party recording state so I’d like her to go in to talk about it while recording, but her anxiety is completely stonewalling her from bringing it up.
Hit record on the phone, slip it in a pocket that has good clearance for the whole conversation, and get them to say the things they’ve said when they think nobody else can hear them.
Apparently the front office woman screamed at her to move her car (she parked there because the offices are isolated from traffic and have access to her work area)and “it’s not our goddamn problem we don’t have handicap spots, it’s yours so deal with it”
I’m about to just skip around waiting for her to do things and file a complaint with the EEOC or at least the ADA government site complaint form. I’m sure that would take months, if not years before anything ever happened, but I can’t hold her hand and be there when she confronts the owners about their 6-8 missing handicap spots.
I thought that once too and ignored my gut feeling. It was the most toxic work environment that I’ve ever experienced, and it essentially killed my software development career. I was eventually laid off and never recovered. I’m now a mail carrier.
I actually work for Canada Post. We’ve heard rumblings of the pre-sequenced mail coming our way, and some people have lost large chunks of money from it. Contract negotiations are coming up though, so we’ll see how things go. Though it is nice having a union that is willing to fight the company for the workers…I’ve never had that before this job.
Had a similar experience. Toxic company that was awarded a contract hired in a bunch of people, gave us starting dates then a week before we were supposed to start they delayed our start data by 4 months. It only got worse and worse from there. I eventually quit when I was doing 4 other jobs, like with different pay scales and supervisors and everything, by myself. Killed any chances I had with IT since every other company around here doesn’t want to risk yet another burnout from that place. I had the same place interview me twice 6 months apart and both times as soon as they saw that company on my resume they frowned and kind of cut it short.
It was because I believed the lie “if you start in Support, you’ll have a chance to move over to Development”. I spent 5 years waiting for them to keep their promise. I did everything they asked me to do, I even wrote code in order to demonstrate that I was able to do it. None of it mattered. And after 5 years of doing everything they wanted, chasing that goal post that kept on moving back on me, they laid me off unceremoniously. I then tried to apply to development jobs but I kept on getting asked the question why I haven’t held a development title in more than 5 years. No answer I gave was apparently good enough. I spent the next five years bouncing from a tech support job that I got laid off from, and then a technical advisor job (which was really just tech support for the development team) that I got laid off from. After that, I decided I either get a development job, or I’m leaving the industry. Tech Support was killing me, and I refused to go back. And now I deliver mail for a living. It’s a lot less stress than I had to deal with before. And I now get a true chance of a six-figure salary.
Actually, I’ve had more than one interviewer comment on it saying it “shows (I’m) prepared” since many people don’t bring anything to write on and sometimes have to ask for a paper.
As for whether that could be a bonus in getting hired? Meh. 110% depends on the field.
If the question is “will asking unnecessary questions and writing down answers help get this job” then I’d ask if the interviewer isn’t prepared for a couple innocuous questions, then it shows a severe lack of preparedness on their part and I’d question whether I want to work for a place where someone gets shook by their underlings daring to question them.
I fully admit I am already biased against nearly any company that I would be interviewing at, so I’m already more willing to get confrontational in interviews if I feel I am not getting the respect I deserve (you know, the basic human decency of treating every random person you meet as an equal until they prove otherwise worthy), and drop them to keep looking than the average person. I’ll eat ramen and peanut butter sandwiches for a few more weeks if I need to. I’ve walked out of interviews before.
I’ve walked out after the opening “greeting”. “alright let’s make this quick, I’ve got a dozen other interviews today” okay well if that’s how you treat someone here for a simple interview I can’t imagine how you treat your employees on a bad day, get fucked. I literally said “excuse me? You don’t talk that way in a professional setting.” and left.
Then they tell you the previous person was incompetent or something to try and make it seem like they were a bad employee, not that it’s a bad work environment.
“Oh? And who was in charge of their interview?” because unless they have a large hr department to handle hiring interviews, it was probably the person who hired you.
This is when you take notes in your notebook you should have brought with you.
I’ve noticed interviewers get visibly uncomfortable when I write in my notebook. It’s like they’re either trying to figure out if they just lied about something I will be able to reference later, or they just get that natural “someone is writing about me and I can’t read what it is” feeling, I assume the former.
Simon Pegg wasn’t lying in Hot Fuzz. The notebook is a powerful weapon if used right.
This is absolutely true. My former employer (a big box retail company) reduced my pay while I was on holiday. I had been there for years and accrued a bunch of pay rises - but the company got bought out and the new owners thought they could strip me of these because they felt they were temporary and non-contractual.
I got some legal advice that basically said they can’t do that sort of thing and had a meeting scheduled with HR. I went in with my notepad, I stayed calm - pleasent even - no angry shouting or slamming tables with fists, I just politely asked them questions and wrote down everything they said, then read their answers back to them to confirm thats what they said. I had about 6 questions prepared and by the 4th they were visibly uncomfortable, it was an amazing feeling making them squirm like that. After I got done asking my questions, I dropped the legal advice I had been given on them and it was obvious the answers they gave supported my case very heavily. They panicked and reversed all there decesion plus I got back-pay.
But if the first thing I had done is charge in making accusations and quoting the law I know nothing constructive would have happened.
See the goal is to bury them in their own words.
Edit: predictably the company went bust the next year. So long Office Outlet!
Always get them to bury themselves before dropping your intentions.
My wife is currently dealing with her employer and their complete lack of handicap spots, despite over 200 regular car spaces scattered all around a warehouse lot. She doesn’t quite get how to “play the game” like this but she’s learning.
One party recording state so I’d like her to go in to talk about it while recording, but her anxiety is completely stonewalling her from bringing it up.
Hit record on the phone, slip it in a pocket that has good clearance for the whole conversation, and get them to say the things they’ve said when they think nobody else can hear them.
Apparently the front office woman screamed at her to move her car (she parked there because the offices are isolated from traffic and have access to her work area)and “it’s not our goddamn problem we don’t have handicap spots, it’s yours so deal with it”
I’m about to just skip around waiting for her to do things and file a complaint with the EEOC or at least the ADA government site complaint form. I’m sure that would take months, if not years before anything ever happened, but I can’t hold her hand and be there when she confronts the owners about their 6-8 missing handicap spots.
but the notebook strat gonna helpnme get the job in the end of the day?
Do you really want the job if the interviewer can’t handle being interviewed by you?
Yes, because I like eating and having a roof over my head.
I thought that once too and ignored my gut feeling. It was the most toxic work environment that I’ve ever experienced, and it essentially killed my software development career. I was eventually laid off and never recovered. I’m now a mail carrier.
How’s the usps looking these days? You still got that asshole tearing the sorting machines down?
I actually work for Canada Post. We’ve heard rumblings of the pre-sequenced mail coming our way, and some people have lost large chunks of money from it. Contract negotiations are coming up though, so we’ll see how things go. Though it is nice having a union that is willing to fight the company for the workers…I’ve never had that before this job.
Ah i did the thing, oops. Good luck on your negotiations :D
Had a similar experience. Toxic company that was awarded a contract hired in a bunch of people, gave us starting dates then a week before we were supposed to start they delayed our start data by 4 months. It only got worse and worse from there. I eventually quit when I was doing 4 other jobs, like with different pay scales and supervisors and everything, by myself. Killed any chances I had with IT since every other company around here doesn’t want to risk yet another burnout from that place. I had the same place interview me twice 6 months apart and both times as soon as they saw that company on my resume they frowned and kind of cut it short.
why it killed your carrer?, you lose the desire to work in software development?
It was because I believed the lie “if you start in Support, you’ll have a chance to move over to Development”. I spent 5 years waiting for them to keep their promise. I did everything they asked me to do, I even wrote code in order to demonstrate that I was able to do it. None of it mattered. And after 5 years of doing everything they wanted, chasing that goal post that kept on moving back on me, they laid me off unceremoniously. I then tried to apply to development jobs but I kept on getting asked the question why I haven’t held a development title in more than 5 years. No answer I gave was apparently good enough. I spent the next five years bouncing from a tech support job that I got laid off from, and then a technical advisor job (which was really just tech support for the development team) that I got laid off from. After that, I decided I either get a development job, or I’m leaving the industry. Tech Support was killing me, and I refused to go back. And now I deliver mail for a living. It’s a lot less stress than I had to deal with before. And I now get a true chance of a six-figure salary.
Actually, I’ve had more than one interviewer comment on it saying it “shows (I’m) prepared” since many people don’t bring anything to write on and sometimes have to ask for a paper.
As for whether that could be a bonus in getting hired? Meh. 110% depends on the field.
If the question is “will asking unnecessary questions and writing down answers help get this job” then I’d ask if the interviewer isn’t prepared for a couple innocuous questions, then it shows a severe lack of preparedness on their part and I’d question whether I want to work for a place where someone gets shook by their underlings daring to question them.
I fully admit I am already biased against nearly any company that I would be interviewing at, so I’m already more willing to get confrontational in interviews if I feel I am not getting the respect I deserve (you know, the basic human decency of treating every random person you meet as an equal until they prove otherwise worthy), and drop them to keep looking than the average person. I’ll eat ramen and peanut butter sandwiches for a few more weeks if I need to. I’ve walked out of interviews before.
I’ve walked out after the opening “greeting”. “alright let’s make this quick, I’ve got a dozen other interviews today” okay well if that’s how you treat someone here for a simple interview I can’t imagine how you treat your employees on a bad day, get fucked. I literally said “excuse me? You don’t talk that way in a professional setting.” and left.
When I go to client sites I carry around a pad, and I tell people that ask it’s just a prop to make it seem like I’m being thorough.
Really I have extremely good spatial recall and estimating retrofit jobs is a piece of cake in that respect.