Again, I don’t care as much about what’s said as I do about who funds it. Maybe you’re right, and there actually is a significant difference in how may people get killed. But obviously I don’t think so, at least enough to not vote for Kamala and to have a days long conversation defending that choice.

You don’t hold someone in check by giving them $18 billion worth of guns.

I’ve never really watched the guy, so I have no dog in this fight. That’s definitely a dumb-as-nails take. Not anything I wouldn’t expect from someone born to moderate wealth running a company, but not especially malicious.

Hey, can you say more about the Linux install party? I’d be interested in hosting something like that! Did you find or make any resources to help?

Why do you think the Democrats would have pushed back? I don’t believe there’s any factual basis for that. I don’t believe they’ve even whispered a word about slowing military aid. Biden did way more to openly encourage genocide than trump has so…I don’t really understand what you mean.

Amen man, I think the democrats should do everything they can to fight like hell and beat the fascists. Including not arming a genocide (which of course, they should do for more reasons than just winning the US elections).

I absolutely cannot comprehend how them not doing that is acceptable to you, but me not voting for them is not acceptable to you lol…like they’re clearly the moral agent here. All I can do is whine about it, lodge my non-vote and get back to my life. This is their fuckin job. They have unimaginable resources to figure this out, but sure I guess fuck me for not taking my one in two hundred million part in the decision of which party of genocidal maniacs is in charge; sweet or bitter.

No, they’re not as bad, by about the same amount as Ralph is not as bad as Dirk. It doesn’t matter which you choose, they’re gonna kill a kid. It doesn’t matter whether you vote for democrats or not, tens of thousands of Palestinians will be slaughtered using our tax dollars.

I don’t know how else to put it. All the bad things that are worse under republicans are dwarfed by Palestine. Ice has killed…what, a handful of protestors and a few dozen kidnappees? It’s awful of course, but a rounding error on Palestine.

Maybe that extra rounding error of evil could have been avoided if leftists had been willing to acquiesce to the rest of it…maybe. But it definitely would have been avoided if the democrats had changed, and so would so much else.

You seem to be able to accept unquestioningly that the democrats won’t stop arming a genocide (I don’t, they need to change or else the US is fucked, even if they win. Best we can hope for then is a rapid collapse). I think you should also accept that lots of people will not vote to arm a genocide.

That’s your point, my point is the democrats and republicans are both fascists and it doesn’t matter that much which you choose. Voting for the “less bad” fascist to kill the older kid isn’t working “effectively” against the fascists.

Also, a tremendous game. A work of art!

Ok, I’m gonna keep my focus and ire on the fascists. I’ll leave you to spend time and energy backseat driving Sophie’s choice.

You gotta be trolling me man. You’re gonna blame Sophie?

I think some of these may be cool responses to the things Leninists say “when asked about their plan to dissolve the state and transition to stateless society,” other than “it’s going to disappear…like a miracle.” ;) You have any you recommend?

I’m really not demanding perfection. Like look I’d love to see all kinds of stuff I think are no-brainers, good policy, whatever. If the Democrats tomorrow said “no more arms to Israel” I’d still have a million and one complaints…no question they’re not perfect. That’s not perfection that’s like…minimal human decency. They can keep funding ICE keep carrying out regime change wars keep fucking everyone over on healthcare and the environment and labor rights and all that. But arming israel? No; come on. That’s not “demanding perfection”

This is a good joke.

To be that guy a minute, there is a book or two on the matter that are very good…but it’s a good joke and you can’t expect people to read books before making good jokes.

IDK, you’ve obviously got a lot more faith in them than I do. Obama didn’t even say “I’m gonna drone strike anyone I want anywhere in the world, sovereignty be damned,” but he did it. Biden and hillary both voted to invade Iraq. So when Democrats say “I’ll do anything necessary to stop Iran” I don’t put anything past them.

And yeah, that’s the gross behavior I’m talking about. Like…that video is gross, but it’s less bad than any of the many thousands of bombs we’ve provided. I don’t think the nastiness and the policy are related to each other.

Well you’ve found the way to my cold heart. Given those US aid stats, I’m with you, that dwarfs even the genocide of palestinians. And how fucked is that? I’ll need to sit with that for a while…the democrats are clear they want to restore it (or were last year anyway), so that’s a very convincing argument to hold my nose and support the genocide of palestinians? Fuck. Well fuck. I don’t even like USAID because they so frequently use it to smuggle guns into countries they’re attempting to coup. This is a very speculative abstract metric, but if it’s even close to a fair approximation it’s pretty convincing.

I don’t think Harris is an idiot, but I don’t think you’d have to be…like…wars are very good for american arms manufacturers. I’m sure it wouldn’t happen like this, but I she was certainly not less hawkish on Iran than Trump was. Was that to try to win over some of the two-dozen or so american voters who fall into the infinitesimally small crack between the republicans and the democrats? I guess maybe, but I think it’s more likely she just actually was hawkish on Iran.

I’m just not convinced private disagreements and qualms have anything to do with it. We have agreements in place to provide military aid to Israel, and the democrats would follow through on those “obligations” to arm a genocide. Trump 1 did not make a significant increase over Obama, but Biden made a significant increase over Trump 1. Trump 2 isn’t even close to catching up. I agree the private disagreements and qualms are nicer than trump’s jeering nastiness, but that difference in nastiness is not worth a single death, so I’m not really interested in saying ‘that’s what makes it worse.’

Jeffrey Sachs is a cool smart and good guy. He gets how things work and wants things to go well for people.

My answer is stop backseat driving Sophie’s choice. STFU and resist genocide.

When you’re Sophie, you pick whoever you want, I don’t care, I’m not gonna criticize you for it.

It really is just good! I haven’t started using it full-time but I keep thinking I should try it at least for a bit.

So that’s a no? you don’t have any reason to suspect Harris wouldn’t have just maintained business as usual, bankrolling and arming the genocide of palestinians? I have no doubt she’d do it more quietly, more politely, with less cheering and more…grim resolve. Maybe a single tear would roll down her face as she hands over the bombs that will be used to dismember Palestinian children.

As far as I can tell it’d be the same bullets in the IDF’s guns, the same bombs on their planes. Trump is a monster, obviously, and hasn’t done anything better, but you’re saying he’s worse for palestinians and I haven’t seen any reason to think so. He’s worse for a whole mess of other reasons, and there’s no denying that, but I just don’t see why everyone in here is so sure the democrats would have done anything different with regard to palestine.

Sorry, to be clear, in my edit I meant if both sides cut US military aid to Israel, not aid in general. And yeah cutting off USAID is horrifying. I don’t think the scale is the same as the genocide in palestine (it’s a lot less money, and I think that money spent buying bombs is probably more effective at killing than money buying aid is at saving lives, but I may be wrong about that), but no doubt that’s one major difference. There are lots of differences, and I don’t deny they matter. I just deny they matter as much as the agreement between the parties to help israel exterminate Palestinians.

I’m also not convinced Harris wouldn’t have us invading Iran all the same; she was extremely hawkish on Iran. Just go look at what she was saying in 2024.

I also don’t see any reason to think Palestinians would have been better off under Harris. Biden gave way more to Israel than Trump has (again, granted, he had more time to do so…i just don’t see any reason to think it would ever go down). Maybe bibi and putin “feel empowered,” and we’re just gonna vibes that into assuming it’s actually worse? IDK vibes don’t make guns go bang, bullets do, and it’s the bullets that I think are the same.

And as for how it helped; it hasn’t yet. If the democrats announce that they’re changing course on Palestine, then win, then follow through I’ll feel like it’s made all the difference in the world. I’m not holding my breath, but that’s how it’ll help. As I said, i don’ think voting for the democrats wouldn’t have helped either, so I’d rather try for the option that has a chance.

Garfield doesn’t work. He hates Mondays because John has to work, and he loves John <3