I had a discussion with a guy, about consent. He argued that it is unnatural and that we are the only species who care about it. Nature only worked because females of any breed got raped.
This comic strip subject was my point that this is not the case. Females actively chose their partners, can deny them and it is eventually them who chose when they want/can breed
While you are correct in your point it is still giving to much ground to his argument.
Even if it is unnatural, who cares. Consent makes humanity happier and more stable on all fronts. If it isn’t natural it is a social technology and we use those to improve our lives every day.
On top of that, and to strengthen your point even more, humans are humans because we have moved a way from, and controlled our animalistic behavior. We likentonsee ourselves as more than just animals. Why then compare us to them when it comes to questions like these
When you are getting consent do you ask them to say the words? Or like take a video of you two saying the words? Or do you just feel the room like normal respectful person? -Seriously asking.
You feel the room. You make a move and then you make sure they make a move before you make another. As tings progress you check in with your partners with questions like “is this ok”, “do you like that” and the answers need to be unambiguous. It’s a bit like being each other’s cheer leaders and hyping each other up.
Another important thing that should be normalized is that women should also check in with men in the same way and if they dont men need to have the balls to call that out.
He might have a point with social mammals. But pedophilia, canibalism, child murder (and so on) are also not uncommon among social mammals. Don’t think it would be a great idea to allow all of that.
People who think that kinda shit aren’t really the brightest out of the bunch. We also didn’t evolve to sit on toilets while typing out literal shit posts to a worldwide forum, yet here I am.
Next time perhaps tell him of the very natural mating habits of the anglerfish. We could dig up numerous examples to challenge his comic book version of nature.
“Natural” would be your town raiding his town and stabbing everyone so they can use the land to grow crops on and then themselves dying 5 years later of an infected toe because antibiotics don’t exist before everyone who didn’t die of stabbing dies of hunger because crops died that year. How about we aim for civilized instead. Also that guy is definitely a rapist
And tell him there is a plethora of documentaries about the birds of paradise that entirely relies on female birds giving consent. There is a reason why birds vary widely by feather plumage because that is a huge factor in why the female gives consent in most species of birds. Female Eagles will withhold from mating and make the male bird retrieve her food to prove he can help raise young.
Some would think about ducks when it comes to rape but even then female ducks evolved the cork screw vagina that indeed circumvents the effectiveness of rape. Even then the female bird decides on consent to conceive as the outcome.
So birds evolved past humans on our archaic ideas of rape for conceiving. Bro can go back to picking his nose and eating it as far as the advise he’s bestowing to people.
The exception proves the rule, but I think leopards and dolphins get raped by males.
I wondered the same thing he did once and realized it was stupid immediately. I can’t imagine being bold enough to actually believe it and then say it out loud.
I had a discussion with a guy, about consent. He argued that it is unnatural and that we are the only species who care about it. Nature only worked because females of any breed got raped.
This comic strip subject was my point that this is not the case. Females actively chose their partners, can deny them and it is eventually them who chose when they want/can breed
While you are correct in your point it is still giving to much ground to his argument.
Even if it is unnatural, who cares. Consent makes humanity happier and more stable on all fronts. If it isn’t natural it is a social technology and we use those to improve our lives every day.
On top of that, and to strengthen your point even more, humans are humans because we have moved a way from, and controlled our animalistic behavior. We likentonsee ourselves as more than just animals. Why then compare us to them when it comes to questions like these
See also appeal to nature fallacy https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_nature
When you are getting consent do you ask them to say the words? Or like take a video of you two saying the words? Or do you just feel the room like normal respectful person? -Seriously asking.
You feel the room. You make a move and then you make sure they make a move before you make another. As tings progress you check in with your partners with questions like “is this ok”, “do you like that” and the answers need to be unambiguous. It’s a bit like being each other’s cheer leaders and hyping each other up.
Another important thing that should be normalized is that women should also check in with men in the same way and if they dont men need to have the balls to call that out.
People use this same thinking to defend veganism. Such a good point.
People use it to attack veganism too.
It is not making rapist psychopaths happier, which still is the plurality.
Are you suggesting that the majority of people are rapist psychopaths?
Indeed, what I believe is that majority of regular men have an unbelievable approach to women.
That is not the same statement as men being psychotic rapists. Is that what you believe or is this what you believe?
Apart from being an asshole, this guy doesn’t understand how this stuff works at all.
Paying rent, having a job are all unnatural too. Pretty sure, the dude is doing those too.
[X] Doubt
It is also super natural for some creatures to eat it’s partners after fertilizing their eggs. Just a heads up. 👍
He might have a point with social mammals. But pedophilia, canibalism, child murder (and so on) are also not uncommon among social mammals. Don’t think it would be a great idea to allow all of that.
People who think that kinda shit aren’t really the brightest out of the bunch. We also didn’t evolve to sit on toilets while typing out literal shit posts to a worldwide forum, yet here I am.
Next time perhaps tell him of the very natural mating habits of the anglerfish. We could dig up numerous examples to challenge his comic book version of nature.
“Natural” would be your town raiding his town and stabbing everyone so they can use the land to grow crops on and then themselves dying 5 years later of an infected toe because antibiotics don’t exist before everyone who didn’t die of stabbing dies of hunger because crops died that year. How about we aim for civilized instead. Also that guy is definitely a rapist
And tell him there is a plethora of documentaries about the birds of paradise that entirely relies on female birds giving consent. There is a reason why birds vary widely by feather plumage because that is a huge factor in why the female gives consent in most species of birds. Female Eagles will withhold from mating and make the male bird retrieve her food to prove he can help raise young.
Some would think about ducks when it comes to rape but even then female ducks evolved the cork screw vagina that indeed circumvents the effectiveness of rape. Even then the female bird decides on consent to conceive as the outcome.
So birds evolved past humans on our archaic ideas of rape for conceiving. Bro can go back to picking his nose and eating it as far as the advise he’s bestowing to people.
Introduce him to the mating habits of hyenas and watch him run away screaming.
From the point of view of a mantis, any sex that doesn’t end in eating the male alive would appear as unnatural.
The exception proves the rule, but I think leopards and dolphins get raped by males.
I wondered the same thing he did once and realized it was stupid immediately. I can’t imagine being bold enough to actually believe it and then say it out loud.
If he wants to live like an animal, strip him and drop him off in some remote wilderness somewhere.
Since our nature is to be a highly societal species…