To be clear, I am only talking about people like the average working class Trump voter. The ones who just got caught by misinformation, and just haven’t been able to find a way out. Trump and all his mates are terrible people, and should be held accountable.
The average voter is another thing. My attitude is that I got lucky, and found out that Trump and his mates are terrible, instead of getting sucked down a rabbit hole of supporting them. Knowing how fascism works, I don’t know if I’d be able to reliably land on the right side if fascism happened in my home country. And if I don’t believe I could reliably spot fascism, I’m not comfortable acting like those who support Trump could have.
This isn’t a discussion of “just be a good person”. I know plenty of amazing, caring people who believe they’re doing the right thing.
This whole idea of “I can’t say is reliably avoid fascism” is based on this, the school that became fascist for a week. As bad of an experiment that was from that teacher, it was an effective way of teaching how people fall for what should be obviously a bad thing.
I blame them completely. Voters are not children. You’re responsible for your own actions.
If we’re talking the average working class voter, I hold a great amount of sympathy for them. I really do understand where they’re coming from.
The Democrats are corrupt as hell and aren’t doing a damn thing for the American people. Pre-Trump Republicans are corrupt as hell and aren’t doing a damn thing for the American people. The country is legitimately falling apart and there’s no one to turn to.
Here comes this guy out of nowhere who’s never been in politics and thus not beholden to their corrupt schemes. He’s promising to tear down the whole damn system that isn’t working for the average American. He recognizes and acknowledges the plight of working class America. He’s claiming that it needs to break completely before it can be repaired.
This is the reasoning behind my little brother supporting Trump. He’s so desperate for real change that he’s willing to overlook a lot of Trump’s bad behaviors. To my brother, Trump is a useful wrecking ball, a bulldozer coming to forcefully wipe away everything wrong with politics.
Of course, Trump has no real intentions of fixing anything. He’s just there to loot the government and shield himself from the law. All of the right wing supporters, politicians, preachers, and business execs are just stepping stones.
Sorry bud, but your brother is a Nazi. Voting for fascism just to change things? My ass. If a fascist tells you he’s a fascist, believe him. And fascists don’t want change. They want power.
Whether they acted out of malice or ignorance, they bear the same moral culpability for the consequences of their vote. They have a social responsibility to ensure they are informed and vote accordingly; everyone should be able to spot fascism and authoritarianism when they see it.
You highlight an important point: the fascists are fascists because their primitive lizard brain responds to hear and insecurity with tribalism.
And we have the same lizard brain.
Point being: fascists aren’t stupid or inferior, and we need to constantly be on guard to reject the same instincts in ourselves.
Having said that: they are adults, and they should be held responsible for their own adult decisions.
100%
It’s not like we can even blame it on the fire hose of misinformation the Trump campaign will never be able to stop themselves from shitting out
Trump has already been president. He failed so hard that he lost by over 7 million votes after just 4 years and 2 impeachments while in office.
Then he was found liable for rape and had to pay millions, then he was convicted on 34 felony counts of fraud, and still he was still on the hook for federal indictments for his attempt to overthrow the government in 2020 in which not only did many participants serve prison time for, some died in the process of it. Many of Trump’s own officers were also convicted. Giuliani has been sued into bankruptcy and has been disbarred for what Trump asked him to do.
Yeah. That seems like a good idea to give that guy power again. /s
Trump objectively represents the worst that America has to offer to itself and the world.
He lied his ass off to get his first term, no one learned from that.
I genuinely felt sorry for his victims that first time.
Then he lied his ass off for a 2nd term.
This time, I feel like people deserve what they get this time.
To me, they’re just as culpable as Trump this time. Every horrible thing that happens this time have zero hesitation to remind people that they voted for it.
Genocide Joe & Kamala Cheney are why Trump got re-elected a 2nd term. That and the annoying blue MAGA that thought genocide was perfectly acceptable when trying to beat a fascist in an election. This is their fault.
Not trying to start an argument, just trying to make a point because I’ve been seeing “Genocide Joe & Kamala Cheney” around a lot lately.
What makes you immune to the propaganda? When I see name calling and throwing blame, it’s the exact same shit we see from Republicans. It just seems childish when we could have had actual debates. I’m not saying Kamala did a good job. She was a trash candidate.
And I’m saying this not to be a dick, honestly. I’m just saying maybe you’ve been drinking the Kool-Aid this whole time. The only difference is that it’s blue raspberry instead of cherry. Maybe give that a thought the next time you call a single dad struggling to buy food for his kids a fascist to his face. Because that’s the easiest way to get them to do the exact opposite of what you want.
I’d love to hear your thoughts about how the genocide in Gaza was all made up
I am considering whether my mother and I will have a relationship going forward. It was already strained by the last orange term. I instituted a no-politics rule to save our relationship.
She knows I’ve been planning to move to NZ because he won again. I mentioned that I’m feeling enormous conflict about leaving my partner (can’t follow due to refugee status and lack of citizenship) and she told me she’s optimistic about the future and we live in the “greatest country on earth.” This was on inauguration day and I fucking lost it.
Emails that I have sent to her since:
Subj: Trump orders US withdrawal from the World Health Organization - Ars Technica
You shouldn’t vote and your offspring have to live with the consequences of your vote.
Subj: He pardoned the Jan 6 rioters
You contributed to violent criminals (some convicted of seditious conspiracy) walking free. You did this.
Subj: You voted to humiliate my friends
https://www.notus.org/whitehouse/trump-gender-sex-order-passports
Subj: Trump Rescinds Biden Order Aimed at Lowering Prescription Drug Prices
You cause harm to innocent people with your vote.
Honestly, I’ve concluded that she’s a bad person for voting for him. I still love her. She raised me and protected me from an abusive father (as best she could). But this fucking sucks and she sucks for helping to make it happen. There’s a real possibility that I will end my relationship with her because of this. And that sucks, but there has to be a line.
How much do you blame the people who voted for Trump or other fascists?
Every one who can be dead to me is dead to me.
Those who are unfortunately tied to me by blood or marriage get the minimum of interaction that family dynamics require me to give.
That’s how it will stay.
Trump voters knowingly voted for a rapist. That’s not hyperbole. It’s a matter of public record now. I think that’s all that needs to be said.
This is more concerning the replies here, but in this discussion, saying “Trump did X thing, so that’s why it’s the voters fault” is precisely why Trump voters exist. You just flip it and say “Biden has been supporting genocide, that’s all you need to know” and that’s a sufficient argument for Trump voters.
The issue is the amount of fuckups each side had, and while Trump is pretty clearly in the lead (I mean, he’s straight up a felon) to us chronically online people, I don’t know about normies who only watch the news that didn’t get the message through clear enough (not American, so I don’t know), or just use Twitter (which is Musk’s propaganda now, btw) or even other media that just recommend you what you want to see. They probably see constant allegations against the Democrats too.
For what it’s worth, I refuse to watch news networks, and have done for many years now, due to the utter drivel they push, and the breathless, manufactured urgency and false equivalence they habitually resort to. I do my best to source and corroborate things I consume across a broad ideological and geopolitical range. I’m fully aware of the rampant idiocy that Biden stuck to for large swaths of his term (and more broadly, his whole fucking career). As a result of that, I’m not ever going to agree that Trump in any way shape or form improved the situation in Gaza.
If anything, my read on it is that he likely prolonged the slaughter by getting his envoy to push Bibi to time it like this - honestly, it’s… suspiciously convenient for Trump that Bibi agreed to the same fucking thing that was presented the better part of a year ago, and that it just happens to almost exactly align with his inauguration.
This is all just part of Trump trying to project the image that he’ll “fix things on day one”. But he’s incapable of that, and only knows how to sandbag and sabotage shit so the timing makes him look better to his domestic American audience (who often consume stories like this in an uncritical and non-skeptical fashion, which is a tendency Trump is fully aware of and relies on quite consistently).
As did Biden voters, what’s your point?
lol, you again?
Oh right, you were that racist from earlier
lol I see the insult effort has dropped precipitously
Go back to reddit
He said he was a racist Nazi who wanted to be a dictator. Yeah i blame the people who voted for him.
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Fuck anyone who actually voted for trump. Period. Edit: it’s on them to try to redeem themselves
Only ones to blame are the Democratic National Committee with their heads in each other’s ass cavities echochambers of corruption. They shoved off Bernie Sanders when the whole left wanted him and his fight for the everyday citizens .
I blame First-past-the-post voting. FPTP voting created a uncompetative environment where these 2 weak unrepresentative political parties can hang on to power.
