People don’t vote because politicians don’t materially benefit them. When politicians provide significant support to regular ass people in way that materially benefit them you will see more voters turn out, not when you whine to them about them not voting. If politicians wanted this to occur, our state reps and their staffers would be in our work places, talking to people, giving them reasons to be involved with the political party apparatus, and providing material aid to the poorest and least represented among us with their own hands. We have bad voter turn out because shitty, myopic politics breeds political disinvestment. This post has it pretty much exactly backwards.
Anecdotally, I have friends from MA who don’t give one fuck about politics. Haven’t voted in years despite me telling them, messaging them with voter registration status, and locations, giving them every resource they need to make it as easy as possible. None of it mattered. Two of these friends in the last year have told me they want to vote for Governor Healy because they intend to use the free community college program, unprompted. Went out of their way to tell me. Another friend told me they like their state rep because they showed up at a union rally for their union and my friend realized from talking to the politician personally that the rep was a socialist who just happened to have a D next to their name.
Vote for supporters of ranked choice voting
I don’t mind the kids being force fed the Bible. At least they’re getting something in their bellies.
This thread is a shitshow.
American democracy ends in a month if things go poorly. It’s done, over, gone. A Mein Kampf reader will no longer have any restraints, no adults at the table to say “no, that’s wrong” if he wins again.
DEMOCRACY. WILL. BE. OVER.
Bitch, whine, fuck you bringing this up in thread last 30 days, I live here. So do my fucking friends and family. I don’t want to see them or I put in camps to be “deported” for having the wrong skin color, lover, gender, or religion/lack thereof.
Fuck you, vote.
Well, with how the country is handling the migrants, they proved that they could have solved homelessness the whole time,
Trans people being put in camps? Nope. Just the gender reassignment for minors is an issue. Just because people disagree doesn’t mean trans people would become ostracized. Maybe if trans women would stop begging for attention because men are always the problem. Never see any issues from trans men. Only skewed views coming from them is their belief of “men can get pregnant”. Let’s not confuse opinions with facts. I don’t have issues with trans people but if society has to revolve around them rather than them assimilating with their preferred gender, then that affects everyone.
Us and gay people would become third class citizens? Are we not all Americans? Why segregate the gays as if they’re special? We’re all Americans. The flag represents us all too. Maybe we should start acting like it.
No one is forcing you to read the Bible. But it’s good to be versed in it. It’s one of the oldest books after all. Even if it is all made up. Religion shouldn’t rule our lives either. I wonder if religion is banned, that sex crimes would slowly drop. Maybe.
The only issue is abortion. But people who want abortions more than any issue resolved is insane. If the government has to intervene, maybe they should make sure parents raise their kids with respect , decency and tolerance and maybe most abortions can be preemptively prevented. Only the medical cases would be necessary.
Abortions can be a useful procedure if used properly. If you constantly get one because you always have unprotected sex, you’re irresponsible. If a man constantly gives a woman a need for one, perhaps that man should get snipped.
IDK. There seems to be a logical solution for these problems, but of course we don’t have time for any of that. Or capable.
force fed the bible.
Dude…I was talking to my 5yo today. They’ve learned the pledge of allegiance in kindergarten.
He recited it, perfectly, verbatim.
I cringed slightly at the “under God” part, as I’m a devout atheist (though we’ve barely mentioned religion at all to the kids).
Once he was done I asked him if he knows what any of it means.
“No. But I can say the whole thing!”
Smh.
Drag thinks you should explain that children shouldn’t say things they don’t understand.
I like it when drag talks about themself in the third person.
Thank you, but drag actually has person independent pronouns. Drag is talking about dragself in the first person. And drag’s pronouns work the same way when someone else is talking about drag, no matter if it’s second or third person.
Drag is even cooler than I thought.
I was, um, gently informed by a teacher once that you can say the pledge without “under God” and it sounds natural as it was originally intended. This blew my mind as a young atheist and made me realize how pervasive religion is.
Or you could just not talk to multicolored cloth
I would consider the daily fascist flag ritual the pervasive thing here. If someone wants to swear by his faith that seems much smaller of an issue to me.
Incidently it seems fascist nationalism and other totalitarian political ideologies to have been at odds with religion in their times and places. See Hitler and Stalins regimes as examples.
Meanwhile my 3yo stepdaughter in kindergarten spends the day painting with watercolors, singing, dancing, playing with others and apparently learning common courtesy (The other day she told me that in kindergarten they’re supposed to say “please” when asking for something).
Much as I’ve wanted to move to the US for the significantly higher salary ceiling as a software engineer, I don’t think I could do it to her.
Well, the much higher salary ceiling might look nice on paper, but let me tell you from experience that it is eaten up quickly by higher cost of living. I have been fortunate enough to work for short (one to three year) stints in the US, most of that in the SF bay area. A few years after returning (more or less for good) to my EU home country where I now have a government job (which does not pay as well as industry jobs), one of my former SF bosses asked how much he’d need to pay me in order for me to come work for him long term. It was quite tempting, and I did the math back and forth and in the end arrived at 2.5x of what I’m making now, and that is on the low end. I have a few colleagues and friends in similar situations, and the 2x-3x figure is what we generally agree on. Between health insurance, child care, retirement savings and housing, your cost will be dramatically higher than in most EU countries, and this does not factor in differences in Labor rights and potential visa issues.
The SF bay area of course is extreme, but a low six figure salary puts you just above the poverty line there (so people say). Working remotely living in some low COL state might be an option, but then again you will live in East armpit nowhere Kansas…
I cringed at the part “pledge of allegiance” and then again at “kindergarten”.
Americans don’t realise how north Korea style that is.
Oh we do. We often recognize it while still in school. But you learn quickly you are not allowed to question it. If you don’t follow orders, you will be disciplined.
Two “patriots” mad at fact so far.
Couple of years back i stumbled over this video, which i as a german think is absolutely fucked up: https://youtu.be/DjX7zoFrd7g?si=6BtMIxqTxtdAYHvi
Quote from the Wiki about the “Young Marines”
The creed that every Young Marine lives by is:
- Obey my parents and all others in charge of me whether young or old.
- Keep myself neat at all times without other people telling me to.
- Keep myself clean in mind by attending the church of my faith.
- Keep my mind alert to learn in school, at home, or at play. *Remember that having self-discipline will enable me to control my body and mind in case of an emergency.
Its absolute insane what they do to this kids: https://www.instagram.com/means_tv/reel/C7T93trOtg3/
Fellow german here, if you want even worse ick, look for “Jesus Camp” on YouTube.
Reminds me of when I had to have a meeting with the school about some additional speech therapy for my daughter. It was in the morning and cut to the Canadian Anthem playing. Everyone stopped what they were doing and stood up for the anthem. Fucking weirded the shit out of me. I’m 47 and born and raised Canadian. Standing or reciting anything blindly as a group is fucking weird.
Freedom and democracy my ass.
Stop wasting your vote with the duopoly; voting out of fear should not be the norm.
Do not give in to the fearmongering that the establishment and the politicians push on the people every four years.
Our long-term goal should be to continue to build up grassroots movements for the working class; this won’t happen in a day.
^ THIS… is what MAGA wants you to believe. ^
Very long way to tell us how straight and white and not in immediate danger you are.
Wrong assumtions on all parts.
Nice try though, racing to the bottom with victimhood so as to disregard others that do not bow down to your ideals.
Again, just spelling out how white and not in danger you are, just now you’re lying about it because you think just going “nah bro” hides how above it all you’re talking as if you know you’ll be fine anyways.
Political tribalism is working really well to keep dividing us.
You have already made up your mind that everyone who does not follow your ideals must have much more privilege than yourself.
No, you just behave in a way that gives yours away because you’re the exact kind of privileged twit who unironically named themself “LeftOfJillStein” like that signals anything other than that you’re a purity tester who can afford to let everyone else die while they wait for their messiah before taking any action towards even harm mitigation.
Again, you made up your mind to have a competition of racing to the bottom, so you can continue to dismiss and ignore others.
I am for fighting for a better society for the future, and that starts by growing grassroots movements and continuing to help our local communities.
I see the Green Party as a stepping stone that will help us much more in the long term, tacking our systematic problems.
Exactly what grass roots steps are the greens taking aside from appearing out of thin air every four years to spoil elections to the Republicans?
I didn’t just make up my mind, you chose to behave in a way that made you obvious.
The green party’s goal is a trump win.
Sawant’s speech, introducing Jill Stein. Emphasis mine:
We are not in a position to win the White House, but we do have a real opportunity to win something historic, we could deny Kamala Harris the state of Michigan. And the polls show that most likely Harris cannot win the election without Michigan.”
That’s who you want to vote for?
The person trying to give Trump a win?
Just be honest with yourself and vote for Trump then. Or, you know, place a vote for Harris and not have republican fascism win.
Especially considering Jill Stein is a tool of the right wing. Democrats are left of Jill Stein.
If that’s true, then you’re in the same boat as us, only you’re holding the gun to your own head instead of having it held by someone else, and talking about what a principled stand pulling the trigger is going to be.
This imaginary gun is being held by the duopoly against the populace every four years, just so that the status quo can continue.
Fact that you call it imaginary continues to spell out for us your position of privilege.
You are no ally of the oppressed. You are an appropriator of our language to buy your own feelings of moral superiority.
I’m going to bet they’re not wrong. You clearly have nothing to lose by throwing away your vote. Meanwhile, others need to vote for their lives and the lives of our loved ones while YOU….
You get to sit and pretend that none of it matters unless you get your way.
That’s entitlement. And entitlement usually only come from a single source.
Hey vote and you can accomplish alllll this wonderful stuff, all the stuff you want.
You: wHy dO yOu WaNt mE tO vOtE iN fEaR.
Voting for the status quo for many decades did not improve the lives of workers.
In fact, we are involved in multiple wars, and our economy is not doing so well again.
Do you notice you misportray again? You vote for change. Sure it might be a little change until the Dems are sure they can keep winning, but that’s how change starts. Like, see the original post again.
Carter wanted to change things. And he got voted the fuck out.
So Clinton learned to go to the center, and he won.
Gore wanted to change things and ran on environmentalism. And bam he lost the election.
So Obama learned to not say anything. He ran on vague hope. But he did the ACA. And what was his thanks? To lose the House of Reps, then again lose the house of reps, and then to lose both the house of reps and the senate.
Clinton said she’d have a map room to fight climate change. And bam she lost the election.
So Biden learned to stfu about environmentalism. And he won. But Biden did green energy anyway. And what was this thanks? Polls said he was going to lose.
So Kamala also learned to stfu about environmentalism and pretty much anything progressive.
That’s what the situation is. The Dems go to the center because everytime they look left they loose. How do you make things progress? By giving Dems consistent and overwhelming victories.
Such an astute point! Well said!
Man… this makes me miss being in high school.
our economy is not doing so well again.
Uhh
Hey vote and you can accomplish alllll this wonderful stuff, all the stuff you want
Voting is a necessary but not sufficient condition for accomplishing things. For example, I voted for Obama to get some kind of single payer and that didn’t happen.
Plus there’s things I want that no amount of voting will accomplish, like the dissolution of nation-states.
What Dems need is consistent and overwhelming victories. Want single payer? Then you need more house reps and senators so Manchin types can’t water it down. Thus the message in the original post.
Unfortunately I can’t vote in other districts or states so I’m at the whims of whatever everyone else does.
Like I said in another post: Voting is a group project and everyone in my group is ignorant and short-sighted. I hold no hope for ever getting the sort of overwhelming victories we need.
If it will take forty years of solid Democratic majorities to unfuck this country then it will never be unfucked.
This is the point where I point to the original post.
The original post is very Pollyanna and ignores systemic and demographic problems that will never allow that level of domination.
I’ve been voting for 25 years and these things haven’t happened, and I don’t think they will ever happen.
It’s a tad simplistic but it’s on point because the left never shows up or votes 3rd party. If they showed up, it would be a big change.
Our long-term goal should be to continue to build up grassroots movements for the working class; this won’t happen in a day.
Cool, now which is easier to build movements under, a fascist regime, or a moderate milquetoast capitalist regime?
Will throwing your vote away in protest of ‘the duopoly’ do anything, in this election, to change that or meaningfully contribute to a grassroots movement for the working class?
We have a thousand tools at our disposal. Voting is one - an important one. Tools should not be misused, but each one used in its own unique way to maximize its effect on your goals.
Cool, now which is easier to build movements under, a fascist regime, or a moderate milquetoast capitalist regime?
Let’s be real here, the kind of person ranting on the internet about “ThE DuOpOlY” is not actually interested in building anything at all. They just like to stomp their feet, and shout “no fair!” over and over again like the petculant children they are, while the grownups are busy trying to prevent the country from descending into fascism.
Not the same person, but I carry similar sentiments. I helped form the second largest tech union in North America. What are you doing to support the working working class and build alternatives to capital? Tossing support at the nearest person in fear doesn’t prevent fascism.
To use your example, here are the options:
- today we can definitely get a Union that covers some tech workers but not all of them.
Or
- today we can try to get a Union for all tech workers, but it’s a long shot. And if we lose, the consequences are that we don’t get another union vote for 4 years and during that time, the tech companies get to run rampant with negative propaganda about unions, making the challenge even harder next time.
Which would you choose, second largest tech union guy?
False dichotomy. The stakes of the second version are the same for the first regardless of union size. There never has been and never will be a guaranteed union campaign until we overthrow capitalism.
Voting against the fascist candidate abso-fucking-lutely prevents fascism. This is an extremely simple concept that one would imagine the founder of the second-largest tech union in North America should be able to wrap their mind around.
I think my point has been missed. The fact that there’s an openly fascist candidate running for president means that fascism is already here and in power.
They’re not in power. But you’re helping them get back in power. If people like you decided to get behind the non-fascist, it would be a non-issue, hence the post.
I can name some of them. You probably recognize them.
- Mike Johnson
- Marjorie Greene
- Mitch McConnell
- Jacob Frey
- Leonard Leo
Nowhere did I say I wasn’t voting. Voting is the least effective method of change that exists, but it’s still a method. I will still be participating because it can lead to minor changes. If you think that defeating fascism can be done by voting once every 4 years however, you will be played.
We are currently in a fascist regime; both parties are heavily lobbied by corporations that dictate policy.
People continue to struggle more and more under both parties, while they play political theater to continue to divide us.
Voting outside the two-party system will help establish that people do have standards when voting.
Voting is one - an important one.
Yes, and a good percentage of the populace decides to stay in and not reward the duopoly with their vote.
Reading comments like this is unbelievably frustrating, because you’re so close to being right, but you refuse to take that next tiny step, which makes you dangerously wrong.
Yes, both parties are lobbied out the ass, it’s bad and it’s wrong, but which party at least tries to mitigate the harm? Yes, there’s unproductive political theater that divides, but which party at least tries to talk about real issues that matter to everyday voters?
Your approach is akin to burning down the house instead of doing the hard work of fixing the roof. You will never get the outcome you imagine by voting for a third party, unless you do the hard work of improving our overall system, from inside the system. You play the game with the team you have, not the team you want.
The problem with this take is that you cannot conversely punish the duopoly by withholding your vote, regardless of whether or not you think they “earned” it. Even if you don’t vote, one of them still gets in. The problem is, the people who are going to vote for the significantly worse of the two options are very motivated to vote, and they will do so.
Yeah. Somehow they think that if they don’t vote- no one gets elected. They don’t understand that a decision will be made without their input.
Or they do, and that’s the entire point.
We are currently in a fascist regime; both parties are heavily lobbied by corporations that dictate policy.
That’s not fascism.
People continue to struggle more and more under both parties, while they play political theater to continue to divide us.
100% people need to engage more. And in national elections quit voting for 3rd parties. Showing solidarity with and not dividing themselves from the rest of the left. Till our voting system is reformed and 3rd party presidential candidates are no longer a mathematical impossibility. With the only message being sent, that you’re safe to ignore.
Voting outside the two-party system will help establish that people do have standards when voting.
That’s literally the exact opposite of what it does.
Yes, and a good percentage of the populace decides to stay in and not reward the duopoly with their vote.
Then they get the lack of change they’ve committed to.
Why is it that any time these pseudo-intellectual “leftists” pop up to spew their bullshit, they’re knocked back by like… 5-10 people that absolutely school them and in the end, all they can respond is-
“Nuh-uhh!”
And then rinse and repeat the following day. What do they think they’re accomplishing? I mean, it’s especially very telling that they’re downvoted into the dark ages on a platform that supposedly leans heavily in their direction.
This says a lot in my opinion. In that there may be hope for lemmy once the election is over and these vapid people eventually collapse in on themselves like a dying star.
THEY ALWAYS COME BACK. But it will be quieter for a year or two. If they’re sincere, and some are. They’re suffering form the same mental weakness/illness that the MAGATS are. They want to believe they are righteous, correct, and in possession of special knowledge or insight. That they believe those that disagree with them can’t comprehend.
If they’re not sincere. Well they’re still like the MAGATS. Malicious, spiteful, and crab mentally. Either hypocritically, simply anti-west like most ML you see. Or benefiting disproportionately on the backs of labor. And know the best way to keep labor down. Is to divide it against itself. Kind of like ML governments do as well.
Lord.
The Lord won’t help us on this one; we need to be the ones to fight for what we demand.
The civil rights movements happened because people were fed up with the status quo.
The presidential election year before the Voting Rights Act of 1965 saw relatively high voter turnout. 61.4%
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_turnout_in_United_States_presidential_elections
People voted in the Democratic Party candidate by a wide margin. 61.1%
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1964_United_States_presidential_election
If we protest, but then don’t vote, nothing will change. So voting in records numbers is the answer. Specifically, in our present case, voting for the party that wants to improve things incrementally over fascists.
I see the duopoly as the fascists, though…
Please provide examples to justify your claim. I’d like to know more. I’ll give you your first one since it’s everywhere in the headlines nowadays - weapons to Israel.
Believing in lies doesn’t make them true. The Republicans are fascists who believe immigrants are poisoning the blood of our country and that the genes of people of color predispose them to be criminals. Just because Republicans believe it doesn’t make it true.
https://www.politico.com/news/2024/10/07/trump-immigrants-crime-00182702
Maybe the real fascists were the friends we made along the way
How is giving your vote to whoever becomes the largest by not voting winning anything? You can do all the other things you mentioned and still make a conscious choice to do the least harm by not voting a demagogue in. It’s just one of the many steps you can take as a person wishing to influence the world around you.
Just like eating no meat or less meat. Will it fix everything wrong with farming? No. Does that mean you should just start buying more meat and not eat it, letting it rot in your fridge instead? Also no! No one cares if you did that and it accomplishes nothing except make the problem much worse, which is exactly what not voting gets you.
Again, the duopoly is the staus quo, it will not help fix the systematic problems our society faces.
Then get involved in a 3rd party that works against the republican fascists and coordinates with Democrats for ballot access like WFP.
Whining about “the duopoly” and not voting will just move things further right.
There is the right to cast a vote, also a right to protest.
Please don’t confuse the two and protest by not voting.
Voting and protesting: to create a better society, people need to be willing to demand more than what the status quo can provide.
Heads up. “Left of Shill Stein” is what most know to be called democrats.
4 month old account
Posts nothing but praise for Third Parties/Jill Stein (a known spoiler vote and Russian asset)
Found the Hidden Trump Supporter guys
Nice try.
I know you would rather I vote for Trump than Dr. Jill Stein, but I do not support the duopoly.
A vote for Stein is supporting Trump.
That’s her purpose. She’s nothing but a tool of the right wing. Democrats are left of Jill Stein.
Edit: , -> ;
It seems many of you want third party voters to vote for Trump, but we do not support or vote for the duopoly.
Democrats are left of Jill Stein.
Your political views are skewed; I would double check the records:
Jill Steins platform is nonsense. She has done nothing to accomplish any of it, only shows up for presidential elections, and one of her people literally said that their goal was to try and get Harris to lose battleground states for a Trump win as they know Jill Stein won’t.
Said at a Jill Stein event as part of a speech.
Jill Stein is a tool of the republican party and nothing more.
I suggest you find a third party that isn’t completely garbage.
No one here believes you.
Okay but voting is a group project and everyone I’m partnered with is ignorant and short-sighted.
School really did prepare us for real life in the end
Thems sure done did
None were left behind.
God, I hate fighting people just to get them to vote in a way that makes mathematic and strategic sense.
I have a really hard time staying cool and collected when I discuss politics with people who hold right-wing positions. As a result, I never do volunteer work for political campaigns, because it seems like the only positions available are phone-banking and door-knocking. It’s frustrating; I want to help, but I feel strongly that I’d do more harm than good, doing either of those things.
To be fair, you’re looking at either getting shot at, going to jail for assault of a nazi, or at best, suffer a heart attack from the sheer blood pressure one gets dealing with those insufferable people. I think not volunteering is probably for the best, haha.
How about putting up signs?
“You” in this context, is reffering to over 200,000,000 individuals.
Fuck your gun control. If you’d stop trying to disarm the proletariat you’d have all the other things.
This might surprise you, but we don’t want gun control.
We want to send our kids to school with out worrying that some whackjob is gonna loose 200 round of military grade firepower into their classroom.
We want to to be able to stand in line for pizza without it being a life threatening event.
We want fast food workers to be able to run out of French fries without getting fired upon.
We want to be able to sleep in our own beds, in our own homes without worrying that our neighbors will mix up houses, come in, and shoot us thinking we are an intruder.
Thats what we fucking want, and if you can find a way to get all that without enacting very slight inconveniences to the sale and ownership of firearms in the US, then you need to speak up. Otherwise you need to fucking shut up.
What I don’t understand is what harm is being reduced by doing “harm reduction”? I get maybe one or two election cycles the candidate isn’t ideal but after decades of horrible candidates that increasingly become more right wing over time it seems that no real harm is being reduced. Working class people are are still starving under Biden and likely will under Kamala, simultaneously the Capitalist class continues to aquire obscene amounts of wealth. Meanwhile we’re all supposed to go along with the idea that Neoliberalism is the only option while so called “radical leftists” (social democrats and social liberals) are too extreme for government. This election cycle we’re offered a candidate that has promised to encourage fracking, likley will not offer any federal protections for women and other minorities, openly supports Israel, and is overall a spineless corrupt career politican that for some reason we’re all supposed to nod our heads to and say “yup shes the face of the American left”. If we keep doing “harm reduction” soon we will all be reduced to nothing.
It’s not about harm reduction, it’s a slow boil towards fascism. We’re all just frogs in a pot of slowly heating water, except frogs actually will jump out before they boil to death; humans aren’t that smart.
Every four years the centrists say “vote for us, because the Other Guy is worse!” And they’re not wrong, especially since 2016. But they’re also not even pretending to be on our side anymore. Everyone says the Republicans have taken the mask off and aren’t hiding their evil, but it is the Democrats running a candidate who is openly working with members of the party of greater fascism, it’s the Democratic candidate who is pro
fuckingfracking the earth, and it’s the Democrats (as well as the Repubs) who aren’t even bothering to lie to us about wanting to stop the genocide that our tax dollars are directly funding.However, I have to say that I’ll be voting for the party of lesser (or at least slower) fascism come November. Not because I agree with a single thing they’re doing (since their platform is still “We’re not as bad as the Other Guy”), but because they threw us exactly two bones in dropping Biden and giving the VP to one of the few Ds who actually looks progressive (where he can do the least damage, of course).
Don’t believe the naysayers. No matter which state you are in, your vote is important. Extreme Conservatives have been taking over school boards and imposing their agenda on kids.
Offices like Sheriff, Coroner, Secretary of State, Lt Governor, State Representatives, City and County Councils etc. are all important.
Every Vote Counts!!!
Offices like Sheriff, Coroner, Secretary of State, Lt Governor, State Representatives, City and County Councils etc. are all important.
Not only are they important, it’s exactly how the freaks running the GOP took control of the party. They’ve been grinding 2 things consistently for decades: down ballot races and the judiciary. It’s been wildly successful for them. We are going to have to match if not duplicate that effort.
The shittiest part though is how many of those crazies are running unopposed.
80% of Americans don’t support gun control. American Political parties are coalitions among themselves. Even if Ds won by 20 points they won’t have the support to do things like implement nationalized healthcare or overturning the 2nd Amendment.
80% of Americans don’t support gun control
Lol, seriously? Did your NRA rep tell you that blatant lie? Source please.
Most Americans are stupid and think gun control means Guntakeaway
“80% of Americans don’t support gun control” is pretty laughable wrong, considering the numbers actually paint a much different picture. According to Pew and APMRL, 58% of Americans want stricter gun laws, and nearly everyone—86%—supports universal background checks. 86%. Not exactly a fringe opinion, is it?
Also, the idea that no one’s on board with any gun control measures conveniently ignores the fact that a majority of Republicans even support some restrictions like keeping guns out of the hands of people with mental illnesses. It’s almost like you made this number up.
Sure, not every gun control proposal gets broad support—take things like an assault weapons ban, which has more partisan splits—but even there, almost three-quarters of Americans are on board with requiring licensing and testing, just like with cars. So, trying to paint gun control as some sort of massively unpopular idea just falls flat.
According to Pew and APMRL, 58% of Americans want stricter gun laws, and nearly everyone—86%—supports universal background checks. 86%. Not exactly a fringe opinion, is it?
They hyper majority of gun sales have background checks involved in them. Universal background checks would either ban the private sale of guns (which SCOTUS would likely overturn) or open up the background check system to private citizens (which will almost certainly be abused from a computer security perspective & will lead to people realizing just how poor the system is).
The point isn’t that 80% don’t support gun control, it’s that each thing on the wishlist isn’t widely popular. And even if the actions would lead to a landslide, Americans wouldn’t be happy about it.
So, you’re concerned about universal background checks affecting private sales? The whole point is to prevent dangerous individuals from using these loopholes to buy guns. Your argument is basically defending a system that lets people bypass regulations using airy justifications even though it’s exactly why universal checks are necessary.
Your claim about potential abuse from a “computer security perspective” is just weak. There’s no concrete evidence that this would be a serious, unsolvable issue. We handle sensitive data in far more complex systems, so throwing out vague concerns isn’t a valid argument. It’s just a way to avoid real engagement.
And your SCOTUS speculation? It’s a distraction. Sure, legal challenges might come up, but that doesn’t erase the fact that 86% of Americans want universal background checks. Hiding behind hypothetical court rulings doesn’t change the overwhelming public support.
Your entire response relies on hypothetical fears, speculative legal scenarios, and flimsy concerns about private sales. It’s laughable that you can be so incredibly far off the mark about actual opinions of Americans on these topics while simultaneously claiming to speak for them. But none of it holds up against the simple fact that most Americans—across party lines—support stronger background checks and more gun control. You’re flailing to avoid engaging with the data, and it’s not working.
The whole point is to prevent dangerous individuals from using these loopholes to buy guns.
Dangerous individuals largely aren’t using this loophole to buy guns. That’s part of the problem.
The only gun control that might have a chance at stopping gun crime is a total civilian ban and that requires an Amendment.
You would have to define “gun control”. As I’m sure that more than 20% of Americans would be in favor of incarcerated prisoners not being allowed to carry guns, which is a form of “gun control”.
Which is why Reps are the ones constantly vying for various “voter security” measures (voter suppression).
Vote like your life depends on it. Because it does.
