For me as a user it always looked like Microsoft looks at how Apple does it and is eagerly employs the worst practices of not allowing the user to do anything ‘forbidden’ and not giving the user control in general.
Google is doing pretty much the same with Android for a long time, too.
My only apple device was an iPod and it was the most cumbersome thing ever. Trying to put music on it on my own laptop was impossible as iTunes wouldn’t install. So I’d need to use someone else’s computer which would default to synchronizing their library with my device. So all my loser video game soundtracks will be on someone else’s device or their american sex music will be on mine. And those 33 pin or whatever Proprietary Cables broke if you breathed on it. Adding music was the closest thing to pulling teeth without actually pulling teeth.
Getting an Android phone instead of an iPhone was literally like breaking free. I can manage my own files directly on the device. I can download apps from anywhere. I can download music without proprietary software and expensive fragile cables. Oh, right, and I can charge it with the same cable my old brick phone used, the one that came with my portable charger, and one that powered my USB fan. A Standard Cable. Ffs.
So absolutely nothing to do with Mac at all. And you’re referencing a cable that hasn’t been used in literally over a decade and comparing it to a a cable that you’re using now? You do realize Android phones in 2010 used proprietary cables too, right?
I got my first android (Samsung Galaxy S3) in 2014, before I had a LG Rumor Touch. Both used micro USB.
I was turned off from Apple anything after having an iPod as a gift and discreetly hating it. I was further turned off when I saw that an iPad is just an elongated iPod Touch rather than a Microsoft Surface which is literally a PC.
So micro usb, the literal worst standardized usb connector in existence, is what you are claiming is better than an iPhone’s omnidirectional lighting connector.
And you know how I can tell you haven’t ever touched an iPad? 🤦♂️ “an elongated iPod touch” smdh.
An iPad is a fisher price toy for the price of a Surface. It’s nothing. I used the ones in school and when I was an election day employee. They’re scams
Lightning is still a problem on devices more than about 1.5 years old (everything “smart” that I own) and I’ve never had an Android phone that didn’t use USB, though some had additional proprietary connectors for a dock.
I - carefully - maintained a music library. Got an ipod. Loved the device. Though sync via itunes was cumbersome.
Wanted to sync my tracks back to another device. Nope. Not supported.
Everz track was rewritten into some garbage, including its tags.
Locked in a prison without knowing.
My elderly parents got iphones.
They started sharing pictures via their message app. Required multiple times showing them that we - android users - receive aweful pictures. Prison.
Apple watch is only syncing with iphones. Prison.
Used to be an app developer.
Releasing something as open source for ios is not feasible. You have to anually pay 120 USD to publish. Prison.
Therefore you release the app in a paid manner. They tell you which price to raise. And tax 30%. Prison.
A friend wrote a thesis with some apple-writer thingy. Asked me for some help saving in the required file format. Couldn’t manage to. Prison.
They didn’t invent it, but when they made wifi products they didn’t limit them to just apples.
I saw a documentary once about the engineers working to make wifi a thing with Apple devices. I can’t find it, but you can see how the crowd reacts seeing it for the first time https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HFngngjy4fk
Every app on the App Store is so bad because of that fee too. There just basically isn’t anything open source. Its 90% of the reason why I switched to Android.
Out of all of these only your last point is valid and even that is being changed as they get hit by ant-monopoly stuff, I don’t care if the apple watch only works with the iphone or that the ipods are best used with an iphone, i have used my fair share of bluetooth headphones on android and I have a generic smartwatch from Huawei and they fuck off, they have terrible UX.
For most of the shit I do, I just want something that works, for the niche shit I have Linux/windows on my desktop PC.
The decades of “dreaded green bubbles” before RCS messaging, which still hasn’t fixed every problem but is admittedly a good step forward - and almost certainly only because they’re finally facing legal action for their practices.
Same story with the goofy ass apple proprietary chargers - and no, I don’t really give them credit for things they only do as the result of legal action.
This is a really weird hill to be like “what??? Apple??? Anti-competitive???”
This is a really weird hill to be like “what??? Apple??? Anti-competitive???”
This is your very first mention of anything being “anti-competitive”. We were talking about Apple “being a prison” and I was asking for examples because 90% of the people in this thread are saying things that flat out aren’t true. One dude brought up the 30 pin connector from the fucking iPod even.
They have a long history of overpriced proprietary cables and connectors … Are you disputing it? The ipod 1 is a valid example and there were plenty other examples afterwards… They lock you in. Apple is a prison, or walled garden if you prefer that term.
everything had proprietary connectors in the 2000s. I literally have boxes and boxes of old junk with proprietary connectors. I had the first large format android phone, the Dell Streak and it had a proprietary connector. And that was like 2011, 2012! Usb-C was still being standardized (Apple helped standardize it fyi) when the Lightning connector came out. And no, there’s no examples past 2012, it’s literally just Lightning since then.
Acting like cables are locking you in is hilarious. The true lock in to an ecosystem is what Apple does with their wireless tech. You can’t use Apple’s special connections like they do with their watches, headphones, laptops, etc. if you’re another manufacturer. So you get true actual lock-in. A cable costs 5 bucks, even the lightning ones, that isn’t lock-in.
Saying anything Apple did in the 2000s was lock in is just disingenuous, because standardized technology barely existed and it was fucking shit. Every manufacturer made their own cables, communication protocols, etc. because there wasn’t anything good to standardize on.
It’s clear you don’t have any actual examples from literally the past decade so get out of here. This conversation is done.
Switching from apple is like breaking out of prison.
Coming from windows it’s a breath of fresh air
For me as a user it always looked like Microsoft looks at how Apple does it and is eagerly employs the worst practices of not allowing the user to do anything ‘forbidden’ and not giving the user control in general.
Google is doing pretty much the same with Android for a long time, too.
Real question, what things on Apple were so restrictive that you think it’s a prison?
My only apple device was an iPod and it was the most cumbersome thing ever. Trying to put music on it on my own laptop was impossible as iTunes wouldn’t install. So I’d need to use someone else’s computer which would default to synchronizing their library with my device. So all my loser video game soundtracks will be on someone else’s device or their american sex music will be on mine. And those 33 pin or whatever Proprietary Cables broke if you breathed on it. Adding music was the closest thing to pulling teeth without actually pulling teeth.
Getting an Android phone instead of an iPhone was literally like breaking free. I can manage my own files directly on the device. I can download apps from anywhere. I can download music without proprietary software and expensive fragile cables. Oh, right, and I can charge it with the same cable my old brick phone used, the one that came with my portable charger, and one that powered my USB fan. A Standard Cable. Ffs.
Lmao
I had a very similar experience with the ipod and avoid everything apple ever since.
ITunes did install on my windows laptop (wondering why i had to do that tho, why couldn’t i just drag my mp3’s to the device folder??), but it was still an instant locked-in experience. Whatever went into iTunes/ipod seemed near impossible to get back out. Mp3 in, gibberish out. Encoded to some apple © tm format, lost into the void. Coming from a normal mp3-player that was very unexpected and unpleasant.
The only thing I liked about it was the (hardware) wheel.
So absolutely nothing to do with Mac at all. And you’re referencing a cable that hasn’t been used in literally over a decade and comparing it to a a cable that you’re using now? You do realize Android phones in 2010 used proprietary cables too, right?
I got my first android (Samsung Galaxy S3) in 2014, before I had a LG Rumor Touch. Both used micro USB.
I was turned off from Apple anything after having an iPod as a gift and discreetly hating it. I was further turned off when I saw that an iPad is just an elongated iPod Touch rather than a Microsoft Surface which is literally a PC.
So micro usb, the literal worst standardized usb connector in existence, is what you are claiming is better than an iPhone’s omnidirectional lighting connector.
And you know how I can tell you haven’t ever touched an iPad? 🤦♂️ “an elongated iPod touch” smdh.
An iPad is a fisher price toy for the price of a Surface. It’s nothing. I used the ones in school and when I was an election day employee. They’re scams
Mini is worse than micro, which is better than all the proprietary connectors it obsoleted
Lightning connector (2012) would be equal to USB-C (initially designed in 2012).
Micro USB would be equal to the 30 pin connector (and overlapping with mini USB.)
Lightning is still a problem on devices more than about 1.5 years old (everything “smart” that I own) and I’ve never had an Android phone that didn’t use USB, though some had additional proprietary connectors for a dock.
I - carefully - maintained a music library. Got an ipod. Loved the device. Though sync via itunes was cumbersome.
Wanted to sync my tracks back to another device. Nope. Not supported. Everz track was rewritten into some garbage, including its tags.
Locked in a prison without knowing.
My elderly parents got iphones. They started sharing pictures via their message app. Required multiple times showing them that we - android users - receive aweful pictures. Prison.
Apple watch is only syncing with iphones. Prison.
Used to be an app developer. Releasing something as open source for ios is not feasible. You have to anually pay 120 USD to publish. Prison. Therefore you release the app in a paid manner. They tell you which price to raise. And tax 30%. Prison.
A friend wrote a thesis with some apple-writer thingy. Asked me for some help saving in the required file format. Couldn’t manage to. Prison.
“Vendor lock-in” is the backbone philosophy for the entire company and literally every single product and service it has ever created.
Except wifi
What about WiFi? Apple didn’t invent WiFi, Australian public funded research institute CSIRO did.
They didn’t invent it, but when they made wifi products they didn’t limit them to just apples.
I saw a documentary once about the engineers working to make wifi a thing with Apple devices. I can’t find it, but you can see how the crowd reacts seeing it for the first time https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HFngngjy4fk
That’s like saying “when they made products with USB ports they let other devices use it too”.
Is that supposed to be special?
No it’s not supposed to be special.
Every app on the App Store is so bad because of that fee too. There just basically isn’t anything open source. Its 90% of the reason why I switched to Android.
Out of all of these only your last point is valid and even that is being changed as they get hit by ant-monopoly stuff, I don’t care if the apple watch only works with the iphone or that the ipods are best used with an iphone, i have used my fair share of bluetooth headphones on android and I have a generic smartwatch from Huawei and they fuck off, they have terrible UX.
For most of the shit I do, I just want something that works, for the niche shit I have Linux/windows on my desktop PC.
Anything outside of the ecosystem is intentionally crippled at nearly every turn. At least on windows, everything’s equally crippled.
I’m looking for examples, please.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/daveywinder/2024/11/14/apple-hit-with-375-billion-icloud-anti-competitive-lawsuit-on-behalf-of-40-million-brits/
https://www.npr.org/2024/09/20/nx-s1-5119948/a-look-at-the-dojs-lawsuit-against-apple-for-violating-antitrust-laws
The decades of “dreaded green bubbles” before RCS messaging, which still hasn’t fixed every problem but is admittedly a good step forward - and almost certainly only because they’re finally facing legal action for their practices.
Same story with the goofy ass apple proprietary chargers - and no, I don’t really give them credit for things they only do as the result of legal action.
This is a really weird hill to be like “what??? Apple??? Anti-competitive???”
This is your very first mention of anything being “anti-competitive”. We were talking about Apple “being a prison” and I was asking for examples because 90% of the people in this thread are saying things that flat out aren’t true. One dude brought up the 30 pin connector from the fucking iPod even.
They have a long history of overpriced proprietary cables and connectors … Are you disputing it? The ipod 1 is a valid example and there were plenty other examples afterwards… They lock you in. Apple is a prison, or walled garden if you prefer that term.
everything had proprietary connectors in the 2000s. I literally have boxes and boxes of old junk with proprietary connectors. I had the first large format android phone, the Dell Streak and it had a proprietary connector. And that was like 2011, 2012! Usb-C was still being standardized (Apple helped standardize it fyi) when the Lightning connector came out. And no, there’s no examples past 2012, it’s literally just Lightning since then.
Acting like cables are locking you in is hilarious. The true lock in to an ecosystem is what Apple does with their wireless tech. You can’t use Apple’s special connections like they do with their watches, headphones, laptops, etc. if you’re another manufacturer. So you get true actual lock-in. A cable costs 5 bucks, even the lightning ones, that isn’t lock-in.
Saying anything Apple did in the 2000s was lock in is just disingenuous, because standardized technology barely existed and it was fucking shit. Every manufacturer made their own cables, communication protocols, etc. because there wasn’t anything good to standardize on.
It’s clear you don’t have any actual examples from literally the past decade so get out of here. This conversation is done.
That’s just not true, there was for example already standardised mini-usb at the time of the ipod.
With iPhones yeah, but MacOS is not very locked down at all. You can run all the unsigned code you want.
Although you could argue the new Apple Silicon Macs are kind of locked down, since Apple only allows kernel extensions on the older Intel Macs
god, running unsigned apps was a pain though.
it’s always puzzled me why Apple themselves call installing non approved software “jailbreaking”, they’re straight up stating that their os is a jail
They weren’t the ones to come up with the name, so they have to follow what everyone else calls it.
apple usually renames existing concepts to make them sound better though