they said to “educate yourself”, not “get education from experts and professors”
checkmate
I did my residency for 3 years on TikTok and I have a PHD from YouTube.
Mommy blogger of the lake, what is your wisdom?
Dip your taint in water that touched ginseng.
I did that once and my erection lasted for more than 4 hours.
Did you go to see your content creator for that?
Thanks, I’m cured*
Vaccines don’t cause autism
You joke, but I have watched so many YouTube tutorials on unreal engine, Godot, and Blender to learn game development stuff. I wouldn’t say I’m an expert. But I definitely know a lot more than I did a few years ago.
Does Blender cause autism?
Well, I’m autistic, and I’ve used blender a lot…
Here’s hoping
Correlation does not equal causation, guys.
I’m gonna go out on a limb and say no.
I’m going to guess you did more than just watch videos… If you also applied that knowledge in practical work, you did educate yourself on how to use those tools.
Whatever you made is the validation/grading of your education. IMO that’s a perfectly valid way to get an education, for those kinds of topics. It’s much more risky to grade yourself on abstract knowledge where you can’t directly make something and see if it works or not.
So I should start practicing my random medical knowledge from the internet on real subjects! Got it. Thanks!
If they start bleeding unexpectedly just send them to the waiting room while you look it up on YouTube!
I would wait a few years, make sure you’ve really watched a lot of YouTube videos on medical stuff.
Well said. I learned how to use Photoshop 4.0 by following online tutorials. I had no formal training in any kind of graphic design, I had zero artistic ability. But following Doc Ozone and Andy’s Awesome Art tutorials, I became good enough with the software to get a job designing ads for a local newspaper publisher.
As much as I learned, I still never thought I was smarter or knew more than the people who actually went to school for the knowledge, the people who spent years honing their craft. And that was just doing basic graphic design. I can’t imagine the thoughts going through a person’s head when they think watching some videos on YouTube make them qualified to make actual life or death healthcare decisions.
Well yeah, I wasn’t bring up a counter point. My comment was a joke.
Sucking down high quality content has unintended consequences of educating the masses on random shit haha
Ah, a fellow Prager U alum.
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I see nothing about her googling experience!
How many hours has she logged on Facebook?
What do actual doctors who have studied for years know?!? My grandad said rub some dirt in it. Sure, my niece died of e-coli, but it wasn’t the rare pork, she just didn’t pray hard enough.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lancet_MMR_autism_fraud in case anyone isn’t familiar with the study you’re talking about. Imagine being wrong so hard that you lose your license to practice medicine but keep up the act for decades afterward. Wakefield is such a piece of shit.
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That guy committed crimes against humanity. What a thorough grifter
Figured the fraud mentioned in the wiki article covered the “dishonest” part and “wrong” was easier to prove. I can’t rule out the possibility that he’s in so deep that he really believes what he’s saying (not that it’d make the situation any better).
Sucks to hear that you’ve had bad reactions in the past but I’m glad it didn’t turn you against them as a whole. Hopefully enough of the rest of us can get them and lower the overall risk of illness when flu season rolls around.
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I’m actually the same way, I’m one of those that got myocarditis after the vaccine, but I also understand that nothing is side affect free so while it stinks for me I still 100% support the use of vaccines… Thankfully after a few weeks/months the heart palpitations stopped.
I mean … Polio anyone? No? Chickenpox? Oh yeah that’s right, vaccines. They actually worked.
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Chickenpox. Ahem. We didn’t have a vaccine for that when I was a child. We just caught it and were miserable for a few weeks.
I’m sorry to tell you that’s not what happened.
You had chickenpox for a few weeks whilst the shingles bedded down nice and cosy in your nerves ready to strike again when your immune system is down. It’s not over and it’ll be worse when it comes back.
Yeah I don’t believe you
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The anti vaxxer who claims to have gone through medical school though, everyone is gathering to hear what stupid bullshit they lie about
IIRC, he wasn’t even anti vax at the start. He was being paid to peddle separate vaccines and claimed it was just the MMR jab that could cause autism.
Which is still bollocks anyway, but people will do anything to deny that autism runs in their family…
He wasn’t just paid to peddle the separate vaccines. He owned the company that made them.
And if only, it was just him in the autism field. SBC isn’t better than him on the piece of shit scale.
There’s a whole industry of quacks exploiting families desperate for answers and solutions when they feel out of their depth with a child they don’t fully understand. Makes me sick.
I love when people claim to not trust the science of vaccines. Vaccines created using the same scientific method that allowed the invention of the smart phones they’re typing from. The same science that allows for all modern medicine, energy production, manuacturing, etc.
People that don’t trust or “believe” science are too stupid to connect those dots.
most cookers don’t understand what the scientific method is. my brother thinks it’s like some list of formulas scientists use to see if something is true or not, not the entire actual process around theory/observation/evidence/peer review. they thibk “science” indoctrinates people to think a certain way and that scientists somehow are told to ignore everything not in a textbook. no explaining how wrong this is in over 3 years has helped
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I mean, the scientific method produces mistakes - it’s just that the scientific method is also intended to fix those mistakes over time. Being critical of research is helpful for the correct functioning of the scientific method, but this has nothing to do with conspiracy theorists who will question the overwhelmingly corroborated general principles that determine the functioning of AC or light bulbs.
I think you’re missing that she is a pediatrician and not just a “doctor.” Pediatricians administer a big majority of vaccines and care for the patients receiving them. They probably do learn a hell of a lot more about them than, say, an oncologist who spends all their time treating cancer in old people. And they see the effects of them up close in the field. Any doctor is constantly researching and staying up to date. A pediatrician worth their salt is very well educated on all relevant studies even if they didn’t conduct those studies with their own two hands. I reject the notion that you need to conduct the studies to know the science: that’s a ludicrous bar for us to set.
The point is that her education or anecdotal evidence is not relevant to begin with.
That is neither accurate nor the point.
How is that not the point he made?
How is it not accurate? Someone’s titles or anecdotal evidence are irrelevant when statistics about millions of individuals are the only tool to reveal such tiny issues. If one doctor would already notice issues with something, then the whole massive chain that led to the human use of that medicine completely failed in an unprecedented way - after all, even the most basic tests should have immediately revealed problems.
A doctor has access to totally different electronic information services than the average jackass on Facebook, if you didn’t know. Lawyers and journalists have their own versions of this too. So yeah, any doctor has better info than any private individual.
More importantly, they have well-informed judgment about how to consume those statistics, quality them, and apply them. This is quite important as the average Facebook jackass is bombarded by deliberately misleading information which they need to think critically about unraveling.
How does a doctor have different access to papers with statistical analysis regarding such topics?
Does a lawyer have different laws than those I can look at?
Better judgement, yes, valid point.
Have you tried to read a primary resource, scientific article? They are mostly behind a paywall, hospitals and universities pay for subscription access. So yes, doctors and researchers have easier access to papers than the public (and the expertise to critically evaluate the information presented). Also, those large cohort studies with thorough stats are a huge amount of work and always have a team of people to design the experiments, interact with patients, get the data, run the stats, and so forth. MDs would be in the mix there too, it’s not like a single immunologist would do the whole thing alone…
In even more fairness, reading memes on Facebook makes you even less of an expert on vaccines.
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Nowhere did the woman in the image claim to be an “expert,” though, so why bring it up? Everyone giving advice about something doesn’t have to be an expert.
They’re trying to cast doubt. Doesn’t need to make sense, just needs to increase turmoil in the world.
Perhaps agree she’s not an “expert” but she’s certainly “educated”
Sure, but the person told her to educate herself which she responded to.
You can get into a research career as an MD too. It’s not strictly clinical practice.
We’re all encouraged to publish papers.
In all fairness downplaying medical school makes you ignorant
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Med school is definitely not a trade school. The amount of material I learned per day in med school was about the same quantity as a week of college.
First of all, fuck you. Nowhere did anyone say she was an expert. Like let me just pick up this goal post and move it.
Second of all fuck you. You don’t need to be an expert know the experts opinion.
Did I mention, fuck you?
You ok?
Better now
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Anyone who tells you to “educate yourself” probably barely made it out of high school.
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Censoring a slur doesn’t really make it less of a slur.
First of all, you don’t need to censor yourself. Everyone knows what you wrote and the teacher isn’t going to get mad at you.
Second, censoring slurs is still a slur. Cut it out. You know better, hence the censor, but you chose to be an asshole anyway.
No I think it’s fair to use against people who SHOULD rightly be wiser than they are ever capable of demonstrating.
"I only use the n-word when the black person I’m saying it to deserves it. "
-you, probably
The only person who ever basically said that vaccines cause autism was Andrew Wakefield and he was a con artist who was trying to sell his special magic don’t give you autism vaccine, which turned out to be the same stuff as the “autism vaccine” or in some cases saline.
He had his medical licence revoked. He should have gone to prison.
Only morons believed him, and only morons continue to believe him.
Oh there have been plenty of others who also have said it, like Jenna Mccarthy
She’s just copying Wakefield, he was the first. Prior to him no one had really raised the possibility because it’s bloody stupid.
He just fed on parents desire to blame something on their child’s autism diagnosis. But sometimes things just happen.
I suspect they mean the only person with any kind of “scientific” presentation, and everything after that has been a game of telephone amongst the anti-vax crowd.
The echoes of those morons are why we have a potential measles epidemic on the horizon
Edit: holy shit this post was 5 months ago—not sure how I found myself here
Oh you really embarrassed yourself there. Fancy replying to such an old post, the height bad form.
I’ll make sure to give myself the requisite 5 weeks in the Badger pit
You’re missing a lot of information.
Such as?
Disgraced, former Doctor, Andrew Wakefield originally did the report that the MMR vaccine had numerous issues.
He would go on to say that it is better to get the vaccines separately.
It would later be found that he was making 10s of millions selling test kits.
The link between autism and the MMR vaccine wasn’t even direct. It was claimed that the MMR vaccine caused bowel inflammation, which then caused autism.
Real wackadoo science. Not sure how anyone believed it. We are seeing something similar with the aluminum causes cancer and dementia crowd.
Ok, just so you know, you’re original comment came across as defending Wakefield. That’s why you’re getting downvoted.
False information. Specially the kind the other person wants to believe in.
“Educate yourself” means to look up a few random Facebook posts that agree with your viewpoint and tell others that they are stupid for being brainwashed sheeple.
“Do your own research” and don’t vet the sources
Oh, to have the unearned confidence of the mediocre idiot telling the doctor to get educated
IMO, it’s a bit like telling a fish to learn to swim.
“Not gonna vaccinate my kids, but I’ll be sure to smoke and drink plenty of alcohol while pregnant.” - These people
No it’s cool, they’ll just vape alcohol while they’re pregnant, it’ll be fine.
NO I MEAN FUNNEL DOWN THE ABSOLUTE FIREHOSE OF CONSPIRACY THEORIES SOCIAL MEDIA FORCED DOWN MY THROAT!!!
Seriously. Does this woman even know how to Educate™? She obviously hasn’t listened to Joe Rogan or that troll that crawled out from under a rotten whale carcass to talk about Nibiru Aliens injecting Autism directly into COVID vaccines… Like how can she even call herself a doctor if she doesn’t even know about adrenochrome!? Christ, Jamie pull that video up!
I’ll bet she does that weirdo commie science where they DON’T start with their conclusion, only collect evidence that supports their gut feelings, and then disregards everything else! Everybody knows the best hypotheses are unfalsifiable!
Autism causes vaccines.
Vaccines cause… kids to grow up and become adults. Autism? It means I have limited social energy and I’m so good at seeing patterns I keep getting told they aren’t there and I need to be reasonable🤣
Perhaps the unique perspective and skill sets of people with autism have contributed to medical breakthroughs that indeed resulted in new vaccines.
It shouldn’t be a shock to anyone that diversity in how brains work (hint hint neurodivergence) is helpful to reach a diversity of solutions.
I don’t doubt it
I did not say vaccines cause autism.
I did not say vaccines cause autism.
Didn’t say you did. Sorry if it felt like that
Yes, vaccines cause adults… I’m not a big fan of a lot of those kinds of people, especially when they’re stupid enough to contradict scientists and doctors, telling them shit like “vaccines cause autism” and “the earth is flat”.
Those are my least favorite kind of person.
The Earth is flat people are like entry level 1 conspiracy theorist. They believe in a stupid conspiracy that is easily disproven but ultimately they are harmless.
The vaccines cause autism people on the other hand should be rounded up and arrested for child neglect.
I can definitely see someone on the spectrum being obsessed with biology and solving diseases. If anyone is going be an expert at one specific thing, it’s someone with autism.
Reread the comment you replied to.
Fair enough lol read it to quick. And let’s face it, the internet be like that sometimes.
Image Transcription:
X/Twitter post by user Nicole Baldwin, MD, FAAP @NicoleB_MD reading: Tried my hand at #Tiktok - this one struck a nerve. #VaccinateYourKids #VaccinesWork #somedocs Attached is a screenshot from a Tiktok video showing a woman with a stethoscope around her neck, leaning slightly forward and pointing at on-screen text reading: Vaccines DON’T CAUSE AUTISM A user with their username redacted has replied to the post with the text: Educate yourself woman Below that is a reply from Dr Nicole Baldwin to the unknown user reading: I did. Thanks. 4 years of college. 4 years of medical school. 3 years of pediatric residency. 13 years of clinical practice. 👌
[I am a human, if I’ve made a mistake please let me know. Please consider providing alt-text for ease of use. Thank you. 💜]
Hold up. Whenever I see this stuff the disclaimer at the end is almost always “I’m a bot…” Yadda yadda yadda…
I just noticed that’s NOT what it says. So… Umm… Hi.
Hello, fellow human 🤖
But how many years of youtube study? How long has she been writing papers for anonymous society? I think all her medical practice and education shows how really uneducated she is.
I wonder what that dummy thought “MD” stood for. Mommy Daddy?
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Like it’s a video game and they have yet to unlock it
drools.
I just find it funny they blanked out his name, but not the replied to.
You been put on blast ————. Hah.
Edit: I don’t see the issue with naming them as he posted it in a public forum, but I shall also redact.
That’s my bad! Sorry (not that sorry) Eddy. I’ll edit the photo so it doesn’t break lemmy’s rules though.
I started at a point of “vaccines obviously don’t cause autism, that’s absurd.”
I transitioned through “even if they did, there’s nothing wrong with being autistic”
These days I’m at “autistic people are way better than NT people and I wish vaccines caused autism”
No. I’ve come to terms with who I am and even like some aspects of it that I would miss so I wouldn’t give it up if I had the choice, but it’s a disability for me, has been a very hard struggle, and I don’t even have it as severe as some. I wouldn’t wish this on more people. (Unless it was 100% of people because most of the struggles I have with the tism come from trying to live in a world designed by NTs that probably wouldn’t exist in a world where everyone had tism)
Oh, I getchu. I would say a huge component of the disability, probably almost all of it, is because of the ways society is structured to punish anyone who isn’t a NT majority-demographic person. (Which means it literally would be better if it was 100%).
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Autism is a wide spectrum involving people with different life experiences. It’s ok for you to say that you personally don’t like being autistic, but do not use that to throw dirt on the people who are doing fine despite social discrimination.
Unless it was 100% of people because most of the struggles I have with the tism come from trying to live in a world designed by NTs that probably wouldn’t exist in a world where everyone had tism
…And this adds even more to my point. This sounds to me like the message of someone who isn’t suffering so much due to their innate characteristics as they have due to being discriminated. If you’re at that point, the logical position isn’t “I wish to be normal”, but “I wish society wasn’t so full of assholes and was more tolerant”.
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The most difficult part of having autism for me is the need to analyze everything to try and figure out why people are acting the way they are.
No issues here, that attitude helps to solve misunderstandings.
I was thinking you might have autism from your post
Correct, I said so somewhere else.
They are expressing their feelings, and a neurotypical person would probably see your response as dismissive because you are telling them what they should feel instead.
I don’t want to invalidate anyone’s feelings, but everyone might have misdirected feelings sometimes. For instance, it is common among victims of abuse to hate themselves rather than the perpetrators of the abuse. If someone has an inherently debilitating condition, it’s perfectly natural for them to hate that condition. If someone has a condition that is, for the most part, neutral, but suffers social discrimination because of it, and places the origin of their pain in their condition, rather than in the discrimination, that is similar to an ethnic minority who suffers from racism growing into hating the fact that they’re an ethnic minority. If someone literally says “most of the struggles I have with the tism come from trying to live in a world designed by NTs”, that pretty much sounds like they do fit what I’m saying. Because autism is a wide spectrum, I’m aware that some people in it do actually have innate difficulties due to being on the spectrum that wouldn’t have emerged in a perfect environment, and if you read my original comment, you’ll see that I’m speaking in terms of possibilities and conditionals. But there is also a lot of autistic people who shouldn’t unload their loathing into being autistic, but into the fact that suffering discrimination through their whole lives has made them accrue so much trauma that they’ve developed a different debilitating condition.
I am thinking that you might be getting downvoted because the problem seems to be an emotional subtext that isn’t immediately obvious.
That’s the case for at least some of the downvotes. There is also at least one user who was defending the narrative that every person on the spectrum should hate the condition.
I am thinking they expect you to identify yourself as having autism, and without that frame of reference a neurotypical person might jump to conclusions that you aren’t?
Do you mean this in the sense that I didn’t initially mention I’m autistic, or in the sense of the dichotomy “being autistic vs having autism”? If it’s the former, that’s on their part for jumping into conclusions. If it’s the latter, they should read into it and accept the reasons that lead some people to prefer one kind of language over the other.
I appreciate your interest into having a clear understanding of the discussion. Have a good day.
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Please read the rules of this community before participating again. Aggressiveness is not welcome here.
Have you actually warned and removed the comment that said “no one likes being autistic” as well?
If you see a comment that breaks the rules, please report it and include which rule you believe it violated in the “reason” box. Don’t argue/reply to comments that break the rules, just ignore them or block the user after you’ve reported it.
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Ok, that’s not 100% true as autism is a spectrum. Sure there are some parts of the spectrum that does make independence difficult.
As someone who is on the spectrum, I have trouble with social situations, including sarcasm and taking things literally - I struggle to take a hint and unless you make it extremely obvious I won’t notice flirting… I don’t even notice myself flirting tbh - I try not to use that as an excuse. but I’m reasonable with money management, and I do quite well on my own (I spend more time by myself on my computer and technology than I do with my parents, and we live in the same house.) I have a full time job (still trying to work out how I managed that tbh) with an upcoming pay rise due to a contract buyout. (Let’s fucking go!)
Not all autism is the same, and sure there are some higher ends of the spectrum that people require assistance, and then there’s everyone in between. I needed more assistance in school - I never finished an exam before my extended time limit , and I had regular extensions on assignments. But aside from that I got through it mostly on my own.
I wasn’t diagnosed until after my first semester of uni, as public service autism assessments had a waiting list and going private was incredibly expensive.
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Sadly a lot of that isn’t necessarily about ability to work, but ability to get through a job interview.
The whole interview process is going to weed out the candidates who aren’t as sociable, outgoing, charismatic, etc. They are going to look at body language and eye contact while doing small talk. A lot of soft skills like that are more important to pass a job interview than actual technical knowledge. Even when the job has no customer facing requirements.
They also tend to not have the connections that get your foot in the door.
It’s bias in an interview process that isn’t designed with autism in mind. Many who have high IQ with attention to detail, technical skills and are hard workers are still unable to get a job offer because they come off as disinterested or awkward.
It isn’t just the interview part. The entire job application process is discriminatory against neurodivergent people. For example pretty much any time a company does one of these hokey “personality tests” as part of it’s employee selection it heavily selects against people with autism. They aren’t allowed to refuse to hire disabled people but they certainly do their best to make it a forgone conclusion anyway.
Me and my girlfriend are both autistic and we would never wish this on anyone. Our child will most likely be autistic, and while we’re more than fine with that, we’d love if the kid didn’t have to go through the same shit as us
Make no mistake, I love who I am, but being ND is a disability and struggle for the rest of your life
This comment stinks of someone without a disability having wishful thinking.
Yes, it’s true my daughter is the sweetest, most loving, perfect child on the planet. But she also didn’t get potty trained until age 6. She will never be able to drive. She’s only going to be able to hold the most basic jobs. She’ll likely never be able to live independently.
There is definitely nothing wrong with autism and she is easily way better than any other person I’ve ever met. But she also faces some real challenges in life, and I don’t wish that everyone in the world had that.
Thank you for pointing this out, many people are not aware of what real autism is like, and associate mild adhd or just distraction as a result of to much internet as autism.
If you said that NT were way better, you’d be called an asshole and bigot. How’s the reverse any different?
Yeahhh I can appreciate the well meant sentiment he was going for but he circled all the way back to being prejudiced lol
Because neurotypical people are in the majority, are not marginalized, and have all the power in the relationship between the two groups.
Why is it so hard for bigots to understand that society creates a context.
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Well, this comment tells me everything I need to know about what kind of idiot you are.
How is an ant stepping on an elephant any different than an elephant stepping on an ant?
You know this analogy is bullshit. Saying “type x of people are better” will always be the wrong thing to say
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If you’re like that, everyone will start thinking you are some kind of extremist.
Oh yeah? Well, how many Youtube videos has this elitist “scientist” published? How many suppliment pills has she sold online? Why should I trust her?
