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Go ahead then. Explain the difference without making shit up.
I guess the Israeli far right preferred Trump for no reason.
Notice how you didn’t actually give a reason?
Do you really need me to Google for you why the Golan Heights president is likely a worse outcome for the citizens of Gaza?
Fine, how about his commitment to arm Israel with no strings attached? No humanitarian aid, no cease fires…
Anyone who thinks the Muslim-ban president is a good outcome for Gaza only cares about the real estate value of Gaza.
how about his commitment to arm Israel with no strings attached? No humanitarian aid, no cease fires…
Oh you mean exactly like right now?
Anyone who thinks that orange man is an improvement is an idiot. But anyone who thinks Kamala would be better is also an idiot.
Israel is already getting everything they could ever wish for. There is nothing that Trump could offer that they’re not already getting, including protection from the international community.
Oh wow Trump put the name on the map! Israel already illegally occupied the place and Genocided Palestinians for decades, but Trump but officially recognized it!!! (ignore israeli mass annexation and murder in the West bank the last year too)
When Netanyahu finishes ethnically cleansing Gaza under the Genocide Joe administration and starts building settlements, I will say ‘no biggie’. Who cares about those millions of Palestinians undergoing a Holocaust.
The only thing that matters is when Donald J Trump officially moves the little border line on the American map. Because israel ethnically cleansing and annexxing the place under the Democrats is irrelevant.
Why wouldn’t they? You made yourself fascists by chasing him but that doesn’t change the fact that he was there before you. Of course they prefer him. Just like the American fascist voters you failed to swing.
Being a loser doesn’t absolve you.
The AIPAC donations in the primary went to Nikki Hailey. Trump started receiving his cheques after he defeated her.
Is he in their pocket now? Of course. But he was not their preferred pick.
One mostly exports the genocide to the third world
The other wants to bring it home.
Go ahead then. Explain the difference without making shit up.
Task: Failed
Now, now. They made a distinction. It was just between the value of white lives and brown lives.
Of course, ignore all the rhetoric of trump and is ilk so you can call the other guy racist. That certainly seals the argument
Please take a step back, take a few breaths, and try to be coherent to the context you’re replying.
If I were you I would either recant my position or be VERY offended that I was accused with merit of being a white supremacist. You singled out as a distinction that the bad things would happen here. To people like you. Fairly explicit that should mean something more than the lives that aren’t yours.
This is definitional chauvinism.
Wanna take another crack at replying now?
What is there to be more coherent about? You boiled down that guy’s response to be about skin color
Person A wants to kill 1 million people.
Person B wants to kill 50 million people.
You: “what’s a trolley?”
The delusion you’re suffering is evidenced by the fact you think those numbers are different
He’s right if 1 white person counts for 50 brown people
whatever. best of luck palestinians who are still in existence in this moment.
“Thoughts and Prayers”
Seems a fitting epitaph for America.
“Voting for Harris won’t change this foreign atrocity!”
Foreign atrocity remains unchanged, but now you’ve got domestic atrocities.
“See! I’m helping!”
Let’s see if you care as little about it when it happens to you. Suffer in solidarity.
Oh, so you’re against the lesser evil because you just want more evil.
How are you not blocked by everyone? Here, I’ll help.
How are you not blocked by everyone? Here, I’ll help.
Imagine being this pathetic.
Look at you caring so much about evil when it befalls you. Yet so little when it befalls others.
I don’t get it. Are you happy Trump won, or…?
No, but I’m still disgusted by the amount of gaslighting we got for the last 8 months. All Harris had to do was make a plan to end the war, but she… didn’t. And some liberals want to call it our (people who didn’t vote for her) fault.
More Palestinians will die under Trump. More Americans will suffer under Trump. More people around the world will suffer with a Trump presidency. But at least you showed the democrats…
What will trump do to cause more Palestinian deaths?
What COULD he do?Israel is already getting everything they wanted, and facing zero consequences or obstacles.
I don’t disagree with you wrt American deaths, but that’s not what this post is about
Granted, Biden did almost nothing to slow it down, and kept Israel well supplied with the weapons of genocide. Do you really think it’s a coincidence that Netanyahu waited until the day after the election to announce that Palestinians won’t be allowed to return to northern Gaza though?
Granted, that was almost certainly the plan all along, but now even the fig leaf is gone. Without the need to devote any thought at all to political cover, Israel will stop even pretending to internal investigations of accusations against their own soldiers and redeploy those resources to the battlefield.
The number of Palestinian deaths may not be different, but they’ll die even sooner.
The Generals plan is in full full force. Netanyahu has already fully cleansed north Gaza.
JOE BIDEN IS STILL THE PRESIDENT RIGHT NOW.
There was never a fig leaf. They already didn’t need to devote any attention to political cover, the USA already made it clear that it wouldn’t tolerate holding Israel or any of the Israeli politicians accountable in international courts.
The difference between the two is purely in wording and absolutely immaterial. If anything, trump is being more honest about it.
Trump is terrible for other reasons, but they’re both equal in this matter
More Americans will suffer under Trump. More people around the world will suffer with a Trump presidency. But at least you showed the democrats…
It’s almost like the tankies just want what’s bad for America and don’t actually care about palestine or human rights.
Unlike you who never cared for Palestine and actively defends Israel.
Literally does not matter. They’re all demons, and they all maximise the suffering they inflict. If someone knew how to create more suffering, they’d share their secrets with the rest.
So, it was worth Trump getting a second term in order for you to maintain your moral purity?
Listen, fuck Harris and every other Dem who failed to condemn the war in Gaza, they all deserve to burn in hell for that.
But did you really get what you wanted out of this?
Exactly. It was a douche and a turd sandwich. Refusing to vote because “they’re a turd sandwich” is simply saying “I’m okay with the douche”. It’s a 2 party system. There are no good candidates. Only one that’s marginally better than the other. Not voting is tacitly voting for the worst one.
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Not a USAmerican, but by that logic:
Are Kamala, her party and her supporters who couldn’t get those people to vote for Kamala also responsible for the increased suffering?Are they responsible for the people not being convinced that the suffering would be lesser under Kamala?
Did Kamala and party show significant effort and good faith to woo those people?
Or was it the 99% Hitler vs 100% Hitler thing? Asking since most online discourse I saw on it here in lemmy was like that, where they’re saying Trump would be worse, instead of saying that Kamala would be better, de-escalate stuff etc.Yes, they are morally culpable too. Even more so than the people who refused to vote for them.
That’s the thing about ethics when you actually apply it in reality; someone else being wrong doesn’t mean you’re right.
If that’s how they place the blame, then that’d be cool.
But other than that, in reality, it likely seems to become a blame game, where they don’t want to look at why they lost the trust of the folk who they are blaming.
Though, I’m just seeing online interactions. Maybe offline interactions are much more decent and useful.
there’s plenty of blame to go around; no 1, 2, or 3 people or groups are to blame
best we can hope for now is for netanyahu to bruise the orange ego somehow and find out what petty retaliation looks like
Increased suffering?
How can their suffering be increased more than it is now?Israel is already getting everything could have ever wished for. There is nothing trump could do to make that worse.
There were other reasons to vote for Harris, but this wasn’t one.
Edit: looks like I replied under the wrong comment. Sorry about that. :)
What exactly do you think my current position is?
For my part, I’m not sure it is, though lack of votes didn’t help. The meme is perhaps meanspirited so soon after the painful news, but here’s my question, and this is genuine: now what?
Trump will get to pick a bunch of lower federal judges and probably two more SCOTUS judges. What’s the way out when it seems to me that he and his jackals control the military, the police, and the judiciary? Seems like a hopeless setup to me.
Harris lost, so what’s Step 2?
Oh no, mean spirited comments that don’t actually add anything useful!!
This you?
BuT BiDeN nEeDs To EaRn My VoTe!
If we manage to avoid a fascist takeover, it will be in spite of the naive progressive idealogues who think they have the privilege to vote their conscience.
It’s… almost as if you do need to earn people’s votes after all. Everyone already spelled everything out to you almost a year ago on changes the Dems could make but still you’re wondering what Step 2 is?!?
Dems: We’ve tried nothing and are all out of ideas!, Third party, absolutely not!
Ew, you went through my post history from almost a year ago? Gross and creepy. No wonder y’all can’t win converts to your cause if that’s how you behave.
who’s y’all and what are they trying to convert you too? Are ‘they’ in the room with you right now?
Glad you aren’t addressing any of the critiques and just gonna continue living the meme. Also, you should learn that there’s a neat little feature called sorting, there’s a controversial selection that’s really handy for shit takes to pop up in the first few comments!
I’m most definitely looking at the complainers right now to see if they’re actually listening or have just been harping the same shit for a year and now trying to blame everyone else for the problem. We need to flush out this “woe is me” crap, as if people haven’t been wondering for decades how they’re going to be protected or how could democracy possibly survive in such a capitalistic and corrupt system.
D’s lost, I wanna get back on the field and train with new strategies and directions. There’s just a bunch of butt hurt locker boys who wanna complain about members of the team instead of learning to work together in a different way.
Step 2 is support third parties
I appreciate your answers, but I still don’t follow the logic. Thanks anyway.
and then they continue to get <5% and trump gets another term… then what?
It is your fault.
I’m surprised to see an antinatalist support Harris. Seems morally inconsistent, though perhaps not from a consequentialist perspective. I’ve been blocking everyone sharing your sentiment, but I don’t wanna block one of the few antinatalists here, so I’m commenting instead
Is Harris’ loss my fault because I voted for De La Cruz? She could have easily earned my vote, but tried to court centrists and conservative voters instead.
Being an accelerationist makes even more your fault. It is bullshit the primary was skipped, but no progressives even tried to run there so you would have a similar choice.
I wasn’t asking you. I don’t have a problem blocking you
How did you think this election was gonna go? You think there was still gonna be enough votes for Harris? Or that by some miracle a 3rd party candidate was gonna be elected?
People with your mindset are just as guilty as the dems are. No weasling out of this shitpile were now stuck in
Am I happy I was right when I told Blue MAGA they should stop running a campaign on Genocide and was banned from LemmyWorld?
No.
Was I right?
Yes.
Your takeaway should be to start ignoring the Blue MAGA cult who tell you to stick your head in the sand while Holocaust Harris is speaking. Criticize them and make them so unpopular that they run another candidate who is not Bidolf.
Alright. Well, gotta deal with the pain of having a criminal conman for a president on our individual ways, I suppose.
I’m not really interested in criticizing people, myself. You can do what you like and convince people to join you in whatever way you deem fit, but in my experience, they tend to shut down and stop listening (maybe it’s my delivery). I’d much rather show them there’s hope elsewhere, especially because right now, that’s what a lot of people want. Honey vs. vinegar, and all that.
Alright. Well, gotta deal with the pain of having a criminal conman for a president on our individual ways, I suppose.
By applying enough pressure that they run a decent candidate. Like how they replaced Biden because he would 100% not win after the CNN debate.
By allowing Democrats to run on a Nazi agenda and censoring dissent, the Blue MAGA crowd effectively doomed themselves.
Everyone fell in line behind an emperor without clothes. Are you really surprised the emperor has no clothes now?
It’s been so frustrating to have to put up with Democrats that try to enforce a Republican-style party line instead of building the coalition they need to win.
It’s even more frustrating when they put a hundred times more effort into trying to build a coalition with members of the party they claim to be a threat to Democracy instead of their own left wing.
“Unlike Kamala, I will support Israel’s right to win its war on terror. They have to win! And instead of pandering to the Jihad sympathizers and America-hating radicals, we will deport them.”
- D. Trump, verbatim, on Nov 6th.
But yeah no, this will definitely improve things.
How dare Trump minimize Kamala’s unconditional support for israel committing Genocide.
¿?
Trump wants Isreal to go harder. Even in that statement.
